BEDTIME STORIES: Her Most Underrated Album!

[dylanlioncourt 5,780]

1 hour ago, RUADJAI said:

Don't mean to go off topic... but this video raises some questions...

 She says she's working with Dallas Austin NOW. She Will Soon work with Babyface and Nellee Hooper. But yet she's already determined she will make no sexual references on the album and even plays a finished track? I'd be curious to hear how the writing/producing of this album went as it seems to be put together ahead of time.  

 

 

She originally worked with Shep to produce new material until she felt they were treading old ground way too similar to their past work. It ended up morphing more towards what it was today. If anyone can link to the interviews or write up pieces of the album's background. She thanked Shep in the credits "for being understanding" about her decision to move towards a different direction. 

[MarXus 92]

10 minutes ago, thelioncourtheart_ said:

She originally worked with Shep to produce new material until she felt they were treading old ground way too similar to their past work. It ended up morphing more towards what it was today. If anyone can link to the interviews or write up pieces of the album's background. She thanked Shep in the credits "for being understanding" about her decision to move towards a different direction. 

Yes, she scrapped what she started with Shep very early on.  I recall reading, the direction Shep was going was sounding too much like what they produced from Erotica if not before.  So she certainly was past what Shep and her started on by this time. 

If you listen to the music played in the video, it sounds like finished works of what she did with Dallas and few other producers such as David Hall and McKenzies as we heard songs like "Human Nature" and "Secret" play in that video. 

Edit to add: I have to wonder if some of that music was edited in sometime after she did that promo interview since Take A Bow is being played which at the time she says she's going to work with him later.  Hmmm?  So most definitely this is like April or May of '94.

[dylanlioncourt 5,780]

2 minutes ago, MarXus said:

Yes, she scrapped what she started with Shep very early on.  I recall reading, the direction Shep was going was sounding too much like what they produced from Erotica if not before.  So she certainly was past what Shep and her started on by this time. 

If you listen to the music played in the video, it sounds like finished works of what she did with Dallas and few other producers such as David Hall and McKenzies as we heard songs like "Human Nature" and "Secret" play in that video. 

Should that ever leak someday. Wonder how those early versions sounded in a Erotica fashioned. 

[MarXus 92]

4 minutes ago, thelioncourtheart_ said:

Should that ever leak someday. Wonder how those early versions sounded in a Erotica fashioned. 

Well, Love Won't Wait was one of those songs that she did with Shep.  Remember she gave it to Gary Barlow, but she recorded a version of it, which did leak long ago:

And I guess he worked on early versions of "Secret"  which was called "Something Coming over me" and "Inside of Me" which was earlier titled "I will always have You". 

[dylanlioncourt 5,780]

1 minute ago, MarXus said:

Well, Love Won't Wait was one of those songs that she did with Shep.  Remember she gave it to Gary Barlow, but she recorded a version of it, which did leak long ago:

 

This has never been one of my favorites, sadly. I do appreciate the deep vocals and how sweet she sounds on the chorus. Still waiting on that early version of "Secret."

[MarXus 92]

1 minute ago, thelioncourtheart_ said:

This has never been one of my favorites, sadly. I do appreciate the deep vocals and how sweet she sounds on the chorus. Still waiting on that early version of "Secret."

Yes, "Something Coming Over Me" and the early version of "Inside of Me"  which was "I will always Have you" were originally with Shep. 

Though I love "Love Won't Wait", especially her vocals.  She sounds so great on that.

[Guest Ashley]

2 hours ago, Gonzalo said:

I have this 12inch. It's so beautiful

Well you may be bigger than what’s featured in the alleged Maluma pics , yet let’s stick to topic.

 

[me1981 1,358]

1 hour ago, MarXus said:

Yes, she scrapped what she started with Shep very early on.  I recall reading, the direction Shep was going was sounding too much like what they produced from Erotica if not before.  So she certainly was past what Shep and her started on by this time. 

If you listen to the music played in the video, it sounds like finished works of what she did with Dallas and few other producers such as David Hall and McKenzies as we heard songs like "Human Nature" and "Secret" play in that video. 

Edit to add: I have to wonder if some of that music was edited in sometime after she did that promo interview since Take A Bow is being played which at the time she says she's going to work with him later.  Hmmm?  So most definitely this is like April or May of '94.

Madonna first approached Babyface either at or just after the Soul Train awards in Mar 1994, as a result of seeing the work he did on Toni Braxton's album. He was the one who suggested Dallas Austin and it went from there. She headed to Atlanta around April 16th 1994 to work out concepts with Dallas, then returned to Atlanta from about late May until Jun 5th 1994 to record the songs with him. 

The work she did with Shep may have started during or just after The Girlie Show tour and ended roughly around Mar/April 1994 when she changed paths. I believe she had already set up things with Babyface and Dallas before letting Shep know she wanted to go in a different direction.

The video was most likely done around May/Jun 1994 and as you speculated the music was added in later for the WB records brass. She added the blond streak to her hair around the time of the With Honors premiere and didn't go full blond until around July 1994, so fits to that time period. 

My guess would be that she did all the Dallas Austin tracks first and then returned to Babyface, though they may have already had demos and other things sorted and it was simply a matter of recording tracks. I think the album was completed either Jun or July 1994.

[MarXus 92]

29 minutes ago, me1981 said:

Madonna first approached Babyface either at or just after the Soul Train awards in Mar 1994, as a result of seeing the work he did on Toni Braxton's album. He was the one who suggested Dallas Austin and it went from there. She headed to Atlanta around April 16th 1994 to work out concepts with Dallas, then returned to Atlanta from about late May until Jun 5th 1994 to record the songs with him. 

The work she did with Shep may have started during or just after The Girlie Show tour and ended roughly around Mar/April 1994 when she changed paths. I believe she had already set up things with Babyface and Dallas before letting Shep know she wanted to go in a different direction.

The video was most likely done around May/Jun 1994 and as you speculated the music was added in later for the WB records brass. She added the blond streak to her hair around the time of the With Honors premiere and didn't go full blond until around July 1994, so fits to that time period. 

My guess would be that she did all the Dallas Austin tracks first and then returned to Babyface, though they may have already had demos and other things sorted and it was simply a matter of recording tracks. I think the album was completed either Jun or July 1994.

This all sounds about right!  Thank you so much for including much more detail to this era. 

[Guest Ashley]

54 minutes ago, MarXus said:

This all sounds about right!  Thank you so much for including much more detail to this era. 

It would have also been after the Letterman Late Show Controversy in March 1994.

Was she still dating Tupac at this time?

[me1981 1,358]

28 minutes ago, Ashley said:

It would have also been after the Letterman Late Show Controversy in March 1994.

Was she still dating Tupac at this time?

Most likely, the photos of the pair together (the only known ones) were taken March 1st 1994 at a party for Interview Magazine in NYC. Though she started dating Dennis Rodman around April 1994. We know she often juggled guys, haha. So anything is possible.

The Soul Train Awards were Mar 15, 1994 so she would have approached Babyface around that time or just after. The Letterman interview was Mar 31, 1994

[MarXus 92]

1 hour ago, Ashley said:

It would have also been after the Letterman Late Show Controversy in March 1994.

Was she still dating Tupac at this time?

 

39 minutes ago, me1981 said:

Most likely, the photos of the pair together (the only known ones) were taken March 1st 1994 at a party for Interview Magazine in NYC. Though she started dating Dennis Rodman around April 1994. We know she often juggled guys, haha. So anything is possible.

The Soul Train Awards were Mar 15, 1994 so she would have approached Babyface around that time or just after. The Letterman interview was Mar 31, 1994

 

Yes, this would correlate with the time Madonna was with Dennis Rodman.  The two had a two month affair in  '94, toward the end of his Basketball season, and she has been photographed many times at his games.  If you recall, they did a photo shoot together (I think for Vibe Magazine, and many of you might remember this picture.  She had the blonde hair, which is hard to see here. This was an image used for her '95 Calendar:

Here's an outtake from that where you can see him and Madonna together where you see the  blonde in her hair:

The basketball season was into July of '94.  This last pic was a pretty popular paparazzi pic around the time as well when she was at one of his games with Guy O. in the background.  Ingrid was commonly seen with her at these games too. 

[MarXus 92]

Madonna interviewed Dennis Rodman and did a photo spread with him for Vibe Magazine.  Here are a couple of the covers. If you look closely at the Yellow cover you can see the Magazine is dated June/July 1994.  Most magazines back then shot a couple months ahead of the issue, so this probably in April '94 or early May.

[MarXus 92]

Here is the official '95 Calendar which back then (when there was official calendars) it was always released a couple months before the end of the previous year.  So chances are, Bedtime Stories wasn't released yet when this calendar became available. Most of her calendars usually included images from the previous year or earlier that year.  Most of these were from photoshoots before the summer of 94. Many of these photos came from photoshoots from earlier magazine covers/spreads that year.  For instance, I think the calendar cover was also the photo for Esquire Magazine in '94

[Guest Ashley]

That was the August 1994 edition of Esquire magazine where she was interviewed by Norman Mailer. 

And that definitely was shot months before in those days and the interview discussed the Letterman controversy so we're definitely looking at April 94 onward. 

 

[MarXus 92]

Esquire Magazine issued in August of '94, so most likely these pics were taken in May or June of '94.  I still have this magazine in my possession packed away with my other magazines from over the years.

Here are some of the pics from that magazine:

[Guest Ashley]

Here's a few more from the Esquire interview. 

[MarXus 92]

Yes, I think one of the ones I posted and few of yours are outtakes, if I recall as there were many more images that leaked on the internet years back from this photo shoot.  I had almost forgotten about all these, but it's interesting her hair transformation from jet black to blonde highlights to eventually bleach blonde.  I suspect her intention was to bleach her hair again, so she slowly lightened to make it easier to go bleach blonde again for the Bedtime Story album photoshoot which must have happened late summer of '94. 

Albums were put together much faster then as well.  Anymore, she takes forever putting an album together when in the past she'd be in the studio for a few months and then she was done. 

[Guest Ashley]

9 minutes ago, MarXus said:

Yes, I think one of the ones I posted and few of yours are outtakes, if I recall as there were many more images that leaked on the internet years back from this photo shoot.  I had almost forgotten about all these, but it's interesting her hair transformation from jet black to blonde highlights to eventually bleach blonde.  I suspect her intention was to bleach her hair again, so she slowly lightened to make it easier to go bleach blonde again for the Bedtime Story album photoshoot which must have happened late summer of '94. 

Albums were put together much faster then as well.  Anymore, she takes forever putting an album together when in the past she'd be in the studio for a few months and then she was done. 

Back then didn't she say she preferred to have an album produced under a month and Ray of Light was the first one she ever took a long period of time working on?

[MarXus 92]

12 minutes ago, Ashley said:

Didn't she say she preferred to work fast on an album and have it done under a month and Ray of Light was the first one she ever took a long period of time working on?

She always preferred to not take up a lot studio time.  But she began sessions for the Ray of Light album with Babyface in May of '97.  They recorded a few songs, but she ditch him and met with Orbit in June as he had demos of all these songs.  She decided to work with Orbit and RIck Nowels by then. I believe Pat Leonard came in around that time as well.  The album Ray of Light was completed by November of '97.

But yeah, in the earlier days, she would complete an album in a month or two.  According to Patrick Leonard, what they worked on together on Like a Prayer, it was done in a couple of weeks. 

So I never buy these fans who say her albums were "rushed".  Some of the most popular albums were completed in weeks time.  The Beatles wrote and recorded numerous of their albums in weeks time.  That's just one of many known artists who have done that.  To me, it's not about the time, but the dedication one puts into within the time they write and record.  A good song can be written in a matter of minutes.  Anymore, it's the production that takes time and then music industry usually slots month ahead of time for a release, especially for big artists like Madonna who usually have a lot of promotion behind them.

[Guest Ashley]

21 minutes ago, MarXus said:

She always preferred to not take up a lot studio time.  But she began sessions for the Ray of Light album with Babyface in May of '97.  They recorded a few songs, but she ditch him and met with Orbit in June as he had demos of all these songs.  She decided to work with Orbit and RIck Nowels by then.  The album Ray of Light was completed by November of '97.

But yeah, in the earlier days, she would complete an album in a month or two.  According to Patrick Leonard, what they did for Like a Prayer was done in a couple of weeks. 

So I never buy these fans who say her albums were "rushed".  Some of the most popular albums were completed in weeks time.  The Beatles wrote and recorded numerous of their albums in weeks time.  That's just one of many known artists who have done that.  To me, it's not about the time, but the dedication one puts into within the time they write and record.  A good song can be written in a matter of minutes.  Anymore, it's the production that takes time and then music industry usually slots month ahead of time for a release, especially for big artists like Madonna who usually have a lot of promotion behind them.

I think that's why her albums from Hard Candy onwards aren't as great as the early work. In the earlier years she knew what she wanted and focused on getting the result. Not waste time with over production. I don't blame M, I think it's the producers and writers she now collaborates with aren't in synch with her cycle. 

Of course Madame X is the exception, that album was bit more technically complex due to the languages and musical genres she was working with. 

 

 

 

 

 

[MarXus 92]

20 minutes ago, Ashley said:

I think that's why her albums from Hard Candy onwards aren't as great as the early work. She knew what she wanted and focused on getting the result. Not waste time with over production. I don't blame M, I think it's the producers and writers she now collaborates with aren't in synch with her cycle. 

Of course Madame X is the exception, that album was bit more technically complex due to the languages and musical genres she was working with. 

 

 

 

 

 

Yes, but how is it any more different regarding productions on other albums.  I mean; her 90's albums, especially Ray of Light and Erotica had loads of production. 

The big difference is before she is used to working with a few producers while her last several albums are a smorgasbord.  Then again, she had numerous on Erotica and everyone loves that album.

What I see is the problem is mostly fans!  She's been through so many eras, and gain new fans with each one, and for each huge one such as Ray of Light and Confessions, those fans are usually stuck on those particular albums.  Many want her to repeat those sounds or think she should work with them again. 

Sure, she might have too many cooks in the kitchen or other things going at the same time, but don't you think she was busy on other albums as well.  Think about the earlier albums.  True Blue was being worked on between the time she got married, filmed Shanghai Surprise and Sean had a couple other films going on as well, which Live To Tell was eventually used for. Erotica she was working on the Sex book and filming a couple of movies at the time, namely Body of Evidence.

Her biggest complaint are the producers these days aren't in the studio anymore.  They come in and then go away for days or weeks.  That was the big problem with Rebel Heart.  She could never get Diplo in the room long enough to get everything done in a timely fashion.

[Guest Ashley]

25 minutes ago, MarXus said:

Yes, but how is any more different regarding productions.  I mean; her 90's albums, especially Ray of Light and Erotica had loads of production. 

The big difference is before she is used to working with a few producers while her last several albums are a smorgasbord.  Then again, she had numerous on Erotica and everyone loves that album.

What I see is the problem is mostly fans!  She's been through so many eras, and gain new fans with each one, and for each huge one such as Ray of Light and Confessions, those fans are usually stuck on those particular albums.  Many want her to repeat those sounds or think she should work with them again. 

Sure, she might have too many cooks in the kitchen or other things going at the same time, but don't you think she was busy on other albums as well.  Think about the earlier albums.  True Blue was being worked on between the time she got married, filmed Shanghai Surprise and Sean had a couple other films going on as well, which Live To Tell was eventually used for. 

Her biggest complaint are the producers these days aren't in the studio anymore.  They come in and then go away for a few months.  That was the big problem with Rebel Heart.  She could never get Diplo in the room long enough to get everything done in a timely fashion.

With her earlier albums she knew what she wanted and got the result. Erotica was only produced by her, Pettibone and Betts and they all were in sync with her cycle. 

The producers she works with now days are full of their own ego and to them M is second fiddle, it's not the team work that she used to have. They want her for her status and she wants them because they're the in thing right now and pardon the language it just ends up in one cluster fuck. 

I do agree with your comments about fans and the different eras. Older fans appreciate M's musical evolution, whilst later fans tend to be hooked on one style or era and want that repeated. 

 

 

 

 

[me1981 1,358]

2 hours ago, MarXus said:

 

 

Yes, this would correlate with the time Madonna was with Dennis Rodman.  The two had a two month affair in  '94, toward the end of his Basketball season, and she has been photographed many times at his games.  If you recall, they did a photo shoot together (I think for Vibe Magazine, and many of you might remember this picture.  She had the blonde hair, which is hard to see here. This was an image used for her '95 Calendar:

Here's an outtake from that where you can see him and Madonna together where you see the  blonde in her hair:

 

 

I always thought she had the blond streak in the VIBE magazine shoot as well, but it seems it was a temporary silver streak or clip on, the photoshoot was done at Easter in Miami, so around Apr 2nd or 3rd. She had dark hair until the With Honors premiere. 

Apparently this photoshoot was when Madonna and Dennis first met, Liz helped set it up as Madonna had mentioned she wanted to meet him.

ETA: the first sighting of her with blond hair is Apr 24th at a Basketball Game in LA with Rodman

[me1981 1,358]

2 hours ago, Ashley said:

Back then didn't she say she preferred to have an album produced under a month and Ray of Light was the first one she ever took a long period of time working on?

Her studio time for Bedtime Stories was short. The first recordings started in late May with Dallas Austin and the album was done before the end of July. So only 2 months in the actual studio. So from the time she approached Babyface in March to the end of production in July , only 4 months and that includes everything, from initial meetings with producers to writing and demos and recording the album.

Remember this was the first time since 1984's Like a Virgin that she was working with people she didn't know and had never been around before. Prior to that it was either Pat and Steve or Shep, all of whom she had developed long standing working relationships with over a period of time.

Pat at least had been on tour with her (a pretty intimate creative venture) Steve was her ex and they had known each other for years, Shep had been producing her remixes for a period of time and they worked on Vogue, but Babyface, Dallas and Nelle and Dave Hall were all new to her in every way.