artofdarkness

Madonna and Diablo finished the script!

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On 10/8/2020 at 5:54 AM, Dito said:

Does anybody else think the movie will come out in (Fall) 2022 to celebrate the 40 years anniversary of her career? 

It would be even more brilliant if the movie was released to theaters on October 6 2022, which not only is a Thursday (the day of the week movies usually get released), but also because Everybody was released on Oct 6 1982!

And during these 2 years she could produce a new album and release it around that time too. One can dream...

If the script is written, Madonna is attached as Director and Universal are attached as production/distribution, I doubt it will be another two years before it is made and released. More likely they will aim for end of next year and award season. 

Unless someone at Univseral drops the project and it somehow goes into turn around, which I highly doubt. Only a change in management at Universal or some absolute nightmare of a PR crises could do that.

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In terms of the Guy Ritchie talk, I will say the only thing that was truly odd about the period she was married to him, was how dark, bleak and violent her work got. It seems to have been his influence, but I am surprised, considering Madonna was so against violence, that she suddenly started using this prominently in her own work.

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I personally did like the Ritchie years in terms of the work she was putting out, the tours and just her attitude in general. It was also nice to see people admire her a lot around then. I do agree that her promoting violence in her work was odd though.

I don’t want that era featured in the biopic for the reason that I don’t want them to try and cram too much in a two-hour film, and I cannot stand Guy Ritchie himself. I don’t think he deserves any screen time.

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Violence was portayed also in previous shows - White heat in WTGT, Causing a commotion in BAT, Beast within in GS - but it was often funny or soft. It then became predominant, like in DWT. But it remained after the Guy Ritchie phase, MDNA tour being the worst in that sense. I remember my father was shocked watching Revolver and Gang bang. The first section of MXT was violent, too.

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4 hours ago, me1981 said:

In terms of the Guy Ritchie talk, I will say the only thing that was truly odd about the period she was married to him, was how dark, bleak and violent her work got. It seems to have been his influence, but I am surprised, considering Madonna was so against violence, that she suddenly started using this prominently in her own work.

I've been saying that the Ritchie/UK years were her worst.  

 

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46 minutes ago, Ashley said:

I've been saying that the Ritchie/UK years were her worst.  

 

Not even close.  The music was spot on, her best work perhaps.  Her videos were fantastic.   The tours were so artistic and meaningful.  Kaballah Madonna overlapped Richie so there was that too but her rebellion against being Mrs. Richie was superb.  She was perfecting her feminism.  Pre-Ritchie Madonna feminism was less political and primarily sexual.  Madonna seemed to own the entirety of her personhood after Richie.  Her message of full equality was on display..  After Richie, Madonna seemed more direct and very clear in her messaging.  As the years with Richie went by, she grew darker but I have always loved dark Madonna but they were definitely good years musically and artistically.  

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Just now, Sultrysully said:

Not even close.  The music was spot on, her best work perhaps.  Her videos were fantastic.   The tours were so artistic and meaningful.  Kaballah Madonna overlapped Richie so there was that too but her rebellion against being Mrs. Richie was superb.  She was perfecting her feminism.  Pre-Ritchie Madonna feminism was less political and primarily sexual.  Madonna seemed to own the entirety of her personhood after Richie.  Her message of full equality was on display..  After Richie, Madonna seemed more direct and very clear in her messaging.  As the years with Richie went by, she grew darker but I have always loved dark Madonna but they were definitely good years musically and artistically.  

I completely disagree and I'm sure academics who study Madonna in pop culture would as well. 

The Ritchie years were the patriarchal years and she never rebelled, her politics were muddled, misguided and just following trendy causes and she was never clear and direct during that period. 

Her politics in the late 80s and 90s were more powerful and had acuity and her feminism wasn't just sexual it, she was the empowered woman. 

 

 

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13 minutes ago, Ashley said:

The Ritchie years were the patriarchal years and she never rebelled, her politics were muddled, misguided and just following trendy causes and she was never clear and direct during that period.

what? so american life, her biggest alienation from the american public and consequently a turning point in her career, never happened?

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5 minutes ago, nodoman said:

what? so american life, her biggest alienation from the american public and consequently a turning point in her career, never happened?

Honestly no it didn't. It happened just enough to get her into trouble, but unlike previous eras, she took her medicine and shut her mouth. She withdrew the video (the only blatant political reference of that era) and did not bring up her political view again until a year later when it became safer to do so. Even then it was rather tame and Confessions was even tamer.

Look at her stance and views and how she expresses those post Ritchie. Much more intense and in your face. The same threat she faced in 2003 is still there, she still has young children to worry about, but she doesn't seem to back down anymore. 

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Yeah She was anti war. She said it numerous times back then. She didn’t need to state her opinion on every interview, let alone go on a promotional campaign to talk about her political opinion. She definitely didn’t cave in! I mean, did you not see the Re-Invention tour?!?

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5 hours ago, me1981 said:

She withdrew the video (the only blatant political reference of that era) and did not bring up her political view again until a year later when it became safer to do so.

madonna’s whole persona for that era was inspired by che guevara, which is a statement by itself and goes beyond the AL video. she was literally banned from US radio airplay during that time and, even two years later, COADF suffered from that.

Quote

Even then it was rather tame and Confessions was even tamer.

she was vocal during RIT as well as during CT, although to a selective audience. i remember very well how she wanted the audience to say "f*ck george bush" and they were very hesitant about it.

Quote

Look at her stance and views and how she expresses those post Ritchie. Much more intense and in your face. The same threat she faced in 2003 is still there, she still has young children to worry about, but she doesn't seem to back down anymore. 

madonna was a mother for the first time during the years she was with guy. she has grown, learnt and changed since then and so has society.

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This whole convesation has gotten really confusing. Suddenly Pre-Ritchie Madonna wasn't political enough? Do we not all understand that sex is a political issue (particularly for women and LGBTQs?)? Do we forget what Madonna represented to gays during the HIV/AIDS pandemic in the 80s and 90s? Do we not understand the importance of how her bringing sex into pop music empowered women immensely? I agree that Mrs. Ritchie served us with amazing music, looks and tours, but, I'm sorry, even if it was obvious she was elated living the traditional family life she always craved, some of her attitudes and opinions at the time were super backward, conservative and very anti-Madonna, actually. Love makes us do crazy things, even forget about who we are, and to me, that seemed to be her case. She kept dismissing her artistic and political contributions in pop culture (particularly in regards to everything between 1990-1993), and toned down her act too much, probably to not annoy Guy... I mean, conservative, Brit lady of the pub Madonna was all out.

Of course I LOVED many of her projects at the time: American Life, Music, the Re-Invention Tour and Confessions, but looking back it's easy to see how she kinda lost herself in the process too. Blame it on love? It's interesting to see, but must be really hard, especially when the world is witnessing your changes, relationships, breakups, etc. I certainly don't blame her for going full on "Girl Gone Wild" after the divorce. Couldn't you all see how sad and angry she was then? Even if the MDNA album has many enemies to this day, the whole project was fascinating to me in that respect: Madonna literally took her heartbreak on a crazy rageful night out... The tour also embodied that darkness and overall anger, imo.

Recently M has been looking back and that has been beautiful to see. I think all artists struggle to look back dearly to her early/younger selves, but don't we all? Though in very different genres and paths, even artists like Joni Mitchell has taken her bloody time to fully embrace her early career... For years she dismissed her folky era, and only this year, at 76, Joni finally opened up her vaults and is releasing her early demos, recordings of live/radio show, etc. So, we all give M a hard time for not embracing her catalogue or her career as WE would like her to, but it's her right to delve into it her way, no? The 2010s might've not ended up being her most successful, commercially speaking, but if she felt she still had things to say, create, sing, etc, well, why not? She wasn't ready to look back then (it's Madonna, after all... always looking forward), so let's be happy she's doing that now. Singles being released in digital/streaming platforms, rare videos posted on YouTube... I like the teasing pre-biopic.

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3 hours ago, madfan13_86 said:

This whole convesation has gotten really confusing. Suddenly Pre-Ritchie Madonna wasn't political enough? Do we not all understand that sex is a political issue (particularly for women and LGBTQs?)? Do we forget what Madonna represented to gays during the HIV/AIDS pandemic in the 80s and 90s? Do we not understand the importance of how her bringing sex into pop music empowered women immensely? I agree that Mrs. Ritchie served us with amazing music, looks and tours, but, I'm sorry, even if it was obvious she was elated living the traditional family life she always craved, some of her attitudes and opinions at the time were super backward, conservative and very anti-Madonna, actually. Love makes us do crazy things, even forget about who we are, and to me, that seemed to be her case. She kept dismissing her artistic and political contributions in pop culture (particularly in regards to everything between 1990-1993), and toned down her act too much, probably to not annoy Guy... I mean, conservative, Brit lady of the pub Madonna was all out.

Of course I LOVED many of her projects at the time: American Life, Music, the Re-Invention Tour and Confessions, but looking back it's easy to see how she kinda lost herself in the process too. Blame it on love? It's interesting to see, but must be really hard, especially when the world is witnessing your changes, relationships, breakups, etc. I certainly don't blame her for going full on "Girl Gone Wild" after the divorce. Couldn't you all see how sad and angry she was then? Even if the MDNA album has many enemies to this day, the whole project was fascinating to me in that respect: Madonna literally took her heartbreak on a crazy rageful night out... The tour also embodied that darkness and overall anger, imo.

Recently M has been looking back and that has been beautiful to see. I think all artists struggle to look back dearly to her early/younger selves, but don't we all? Though in very different genres and paths, even artists like Joni Mitchell has taken her bloody time to fully embrace her early career... For years she dismissed her folky era, and only this year, at 76, Joni finally opened up her vaults and is releasing her early demos, recordings of live/radio show, etc. So, we all give M a hard time for not embracing her catalogue or her career as WE would like her to, but it's her right to delve into it her way, no? The 2010s might've not ended up being her most successful, commercially speaking, but if she felt she still had things to say, create, sing, etc, well, why not? She wasn't ready to look back then (it's Madonna, after all... always looking forward), so let's be happy she's doing that now. Singles being released in digital/streaming platforms, rare videos posted on YouTube... I like the teasing pre-biopic.

I agree. Even the Confessions Tour Live to Tell performance was safe and all she got was the expected slap on the wrist from religious leaders and praise from her fans. It wasn't political or really controversial for M at all. 

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7 hours ago, deathproof said:

Yeah She was anti war. She said it numerous times back then. She didn’t need to state her opinion on every interview, let alone go on a promotional campaign to talk about her political opinion. She definitely didn’t cave in! I mean, did you not see the Re-Invention tour?!?

Yeah by 2004 it was much safer to criticise Bush and the war. Everyone was doing it by that point. Comedians were roasting Bush by that time. 2003 was a different landscape and she made a very strategic retreat. She was extremely obvious about it and open about it. She was afraid of the consequences as she had a family. I don't blame her. She did what she had to do. 

6 hours ago, nodoman said:

madonna’s whole persona for that era was inspired by che guevara, which is a statement by itself and goes beyond the AL video. she was literally banned from US radio airplay during that time and, even two years later, COADF suffered from that.

she was vocal during RIT as well as during CT, although to a selective audience. i remember very well how she wanted the audience to say "f*ck george bush" and they were very hesitant about it.

madonna was a mother for the first time during the years she was with guy. she has grown, learnt and changed since then and so has society.

I guess it is all a matter of opinion and it is subjective. So as not to hijack this thread, if you want to discuss further, I am happy to talk more in a new thread. I don't think we will agree, but we can have a respectful conversation about it, or am happy to leave it here as well. I agree though that times have changed and she probably doesn't feel as threatened under Trump as she did Bush. He was a far more dangerous President IMO.

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12 hours ago, me1981 said:

I agree though that times have changed and she probably doesn't feel as threatened under Trump as she did Bush. He was a far more dangerous President IMO.

Was he? I mean he did fuck up Iraq, but Trump is fucking the US, and a lot more people are negatively affected by his "rule". But less than losing their homes to war indeed.

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On 10/18/2020 at 1:06 PM, Ashley said:

I completely disagree and I'm sure academics who study Madonna in pop culture would as well. 

The Ritchie years were the patriarchal years and she never rebelled, her politics were muddled, misguided and just following trendy causes and she was never clear and direct during that period. 

Her politics in the late 80s and 90s were more powerful and had acuity and her feminism wasn't just sexual it, she was the empowered woman. 

 

 

American Life is her most clear and direct work, only rivalled by Erotica 🗿

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