360 Deal & Madonna

[Xander 430]

I recently watched this video on YouTube not expecting to learn about 360 deals, but when he brought it up I instantly remembered that that's what Madonna got into back in 2007, and I started to wonder if that deal is what has led to some of the things that many of us on the forum have complained about over the last decade. 

For instance, this article on NPR mentions that as part of her 10 year, $120 million deal with Live Nation they would receive a share of her touring revenue but NOT revenue from recorded music. Could this be why promotion for albums has been so poor? They have no stakes in album sales, so why promote it? Based on the video it seems like promotion would have had to come out of her own pocket and be arranged by her team. 

There is also this article, referenced in the video which mentions the percentages labels take from different aspects of an artists revenue (e.g. touring, merch, et cetera), and lots of other information some of you might be curious to read about it. 

She has wrapped her end of this deal, and we know that she has her own recording studio built at her Hamptons home, so maybe she is now taking the more indie approach to recording and releasing music. Having your own studio means not having to pay for studio time. No label means she might not be forced to work with certain writers or go to writing camps as she put it. There is a lot of potential for her to do things we haven't seen her do. 

[thegoldencalf 12,573]

Regarding promotion I don’t think that’s the case. Rebel Heart had huge promotion. And MDNA had no promotion because the whole album was basically promotion for the Super Bowl performance.

Meanwhile Beyoncé is dropping albums with zero promotion and they sell like crazy.

The real problem is her management. Mariah made a very successful comeback from a much deeper hole than Madonna has ever been in. But that was on the back of huge promotion of her back catalogue, books and ultimately a lot of effort on her part.

I did notice that organically she has become much more relevant to the new generation and her streaming numbers are improving. They should do a huge push of her back catalogue. 
Also there’s a chance for the biopic to be a success if she’s not directing and it’s done well (like the Elton John and Queen movies).

Also she desperately needs better social media.

[deathproof 10,555]

Whatever radio promotion and deals she had with Warner, obviously didn’t roll over when she did the 360 deals.

The charts don’t lie. Celebration was a top 10 hit in the UK, and pretty much all through out Europe. Then look at Gimme All Your Luvin. It didn’t even break the top 20 in the UK. She didn’t have the same support on radio as she did with Warner’s, especially with a first single.

Dont even get me started on the fiasco of the Rebel Heart releases!

[wtg1987 10,151]

Don’t know why people bitch about promotion of her albums at Live Nation / Interscope ? They were heavily promoted but just  not very good single choices with the exception of ghost town plus a universal boycott of radio springs to mind which will never change now seeing as she is technically a pensioner now ?

[madgefan 10,137]

Warner always knew how to market her; hence, she was her most important artist back in the day. Interscope didn't know shit about her and how to manage her. Yes, the 2010 albums had their moments but also really low points... almost career-ending episodes lol. No matter how many editions we got from MDNA, Rebel Heart, and Madame X. The general public just didn't care.

[Ian 2,251]

1 hour ago, madgefan said:

Warner always knew how to market her; hence, she was her most important artist back in the day. Interscope didn't know shit about her and how to manage her. Yes, the 2010 albums had their moments but also really low points... almost career-ending episodes lol. No matter how many editions we got from MDNA, Rebel Heart, and Madame X. The general public just didn't care.

Absolutely! they messed up many of her releases and they even said that she wasn't a priority for them

For all the missteps that WR made they sure knew how to promote the hell out of M , everywhere!

sometimes M's own hand was the culprit , I mean with Maverick she could've had top 10s even top 5s with American Pie and Beautiful Stranger but she chose to get more money from the sales of her Maverick soundtrack albums

 

[thegoldencalf 12,573]

31 minutes ago, Ian said:

Absolutely! they messed up many of her releases and they even said that she wasn't a priority for them

For all the missteps that WR made they sure knew how to promote the hell out of M , everywhere!

sometimes M's own hand was the culprit , I mean with Maverick she could've had top 10s even top 5s with American Pie and Beautiful Stranger but she chose to get more money from the sales of her Maverick soundtrack albums

 

My understanding is that Interscope is strictly in charge of production and distribution. And all the promotion is under Madonna’s management and expense. Including the music videos. So this is all her and Guy without a label’s muscle behind it.

And Interscope did a great job in promoting and monetizing her tours…

[deathproof 10,555]

20 minutes ago, thegoldencalf said:

My understanding is that Interscope is strictly in charge of production and distribution. And all the promotion is under Madonna’s management and expense. Including the music videos. So this is all her and Guy without a label’s muscle behind it.

Except the GMAYL radio promo was done through Interscope. The video playing in train stations and city centers, Interscope too.

[Prayer 14,279]

Interscope didn't do s**t for her cause she wasn't a priority for them, just her distribution label. They had to distribute her music because of her deal, but that was it. They always put MINIMUM effort. They couldn't care less. All the albums are copyrighted to Madonna, anyway, via Boy Toy, Inc. and Interscope just distributed them. We'll see in time if this deal was for a number of years (usually it is).

Warner promotion, at least for the first single, was always great. And obviously they had radio deals and placements for her. But of course Madonna was "hers" and the albums copyrighted to them, so a new Madonna release was always a priority for Warner. They were making lots of money from them too, anyway.

All that was lost when she changed to Live Nation. Yeah, there was a radio deal for "Give Me All Your Luvin'", but that was it.

[deathproof 10,555]

31 minutes ago, Prayer said:

Interscope didn't do s**t for her cause she wasn't a priority for them, just her distribution label. They had to distribute her music because of her deal, but that was it. They always put MINIMUM effort. They couldn't care less. All the albums are copyrighted to Madonna, anyway, via Boy Toy, Inc. and Interscope just distributed them. We'll see in time if this deal was for a number of years (usually it is).

She was still signed to Interscope though. I don't think they do deals strictly for just "distribution." 

[steady75 9,566]

I think it's really important to remember that Madonnas contract with Warner ended just around the time that Downloads and CD sales fell off a cliff and the rise of streaming really started to evolve. It's no mistake that legacy artists such as Janet / Mariah / Kylie et al all struggled by the time 2012 came around.

[Prayer 14,279]

29 minutes ago, deathproof said:

She was still signed to Interscope though. I don't think they do deals strictly for just "distribution." 

So what else have Interscope done for her then between 2012 and 2020? Cause I can't think of anything, really...

The Interscope deal, even back in the day, always looked like something Live Nation provided for her, cause they simply couldn't release her albums and needed a music label anyway:

https://ew.com/article/2011/12/14/madonna-interscope-deal/

The main deal was with Live Nation and the big money was already on touring.

[deathproof 10,555]

11 minutes ago, Prayer said:

So what else have Interscope done for her then between 2012 and 2020? Cause I can't think of anything, really...

Who cares what they did or didn't do. The 360 deal was a sham. It's a thing of the past. It was all about combining music and tours with partnerships, merchandising, and licensing deals. 

She still signed a 3 album deal with Interscope. Live Nation had no interest in creating their own music division, they previously said this.

Quote

Madonna has signed a three-album deal with Interscope in which she will earn a base of $1 million per record. The pop star's pact with Interscope and the Universal Music Group will work in tandem with her 10-year multi-rights "360" deal with Live Nation, the promoter of her top-grossing Sticky and Sweet tour in 2008. Madonna signed that deal in 2007, and the promoting giant had always intended to partner with a label to release new music.

Madonna's first album for Interscope, expected to arrive sometime in 2012, will be the star's first record for a company other than Warner Bros., her label of 25 years.

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/madonna-signs-three-album-deal-with-interscope-178651/

[Prayer 14,279]

5 minutes ago, deathproof said:

Who cares what they did or didn't do.

Well, we’re talking about it so I guess we do? 

And I do think it’s important to understand the lack or care for her releases between those years. But whatever.

[deathproof 10,555]

4 minutes ago, Prayer said:

And I do think it’s important to understand the lack or care for her releases between those years. But whatever.

Madonna was in her 50s at the time. She didn't have an established relationship with Interscope. Whatever deal she signed, wasn't the same as the deals with Interscope's bigger artists at the time.

[Redha DBL 7,286]

9 hours ago, thegoldencalf said:

Regarding promotion I don’t think that’s the case. Rebel Heart had huge promotion. And MDNA had no promotion because the whole album was basically promotion for the Super Bowl performance.

Meanwhile Beyoncé is dropping albums with zero promotion and they sell like crazy.

The real problem is her management. Mariah made a very successful comeback from a much deeper hole than Madonna has ever been in. But that was on the back of huge promotion of her back catalogue, books and ultimately a lot of effort on her part.

I did notice that organically she has become much more relevant to the new generation and her streaming numbers are improving. They should do a huge push of her back catalogue. 
Also there’s a chance for the biopic to be a success if she’s not directing and it’s done well (like the Elton John and Queen movies).

Also she desperately needs better social media.

What successful Mariah comeback do you mean ? Madame X has been sold at more than 600 000 copies worldwide while Mariah's latest album Caution released in 2018 hasn't reached 300 000.  Same on Youtube, Madonna's lastest music videos have way more views (like millions more) than Mariah's latest music videos. Same goes for her lastest rarities collections, it didn't sell much. Just a little hype for like two weeks with the book nothing groundbreaking. I love Mariah but to say she has had a successful comeback compared to Madonna is not true. 

[deathproof 10,555]

13 minutes ago, TonyMontana said:

What successful Mariah comeback do you mean ?

Her last album, Caution. Mariah restored her reputation, and came back as a well respected and talented musician. She’s well favored by the general public again.

Can you say the same about Madonna?

[Redha DBL 7,286]

7 minutes ago, deathproof said:

Her last album, Caution. Mariah restored her reputation, and came back as a well respected and talented musician. She’s well favored by the general public again.

Can you say the same about Madonna?

Reputation wise yeah probably but commercially no. Here in France i can assure you her lastest albums, just like Madonna and maybe even more, have been totally invisible. No radio play for new songs, no music new videos on tv, absolutely nothing. I know the main reason is the age, J-Lo has just enterr2d in the same agist territory, none of her lastest tunes get played anymore, just the old ones. The thing is that i call a successful comeback when the artists new track is everywhere, like Cher' s Believe  or Madonna' s Hung up. That has yet to happen for Mariah. Now about Mariah being more lovedthabn Madonna yes i know, but Mariah kinda play it safe while Madonna love s to push the wrong buttons on people so ???

[deathproof 10,555]

Sorry, but Mariah was literally a laughing stock and written off as a messy has been a few years ago. She’s done a 360 and restored her reputation. THAT is still a comeback.

[thegoldencalf 12,573]

21 minutes ago, TonyMontana said:

What successful Mariah comeback do you mean ? Madame X has been sold at more than 600 000 copies worldwide while Mariah's latest album Caution released in 2018 hasn't reached 300 000.  Same on Youtube, Madonna's lastest music videos have way more views (like millions more) than Mariah's latest music videos. Same goes for her lastest rarities collections, it didn't sell much. Just a little hype for like two weeks with the book nothing groundbreaking. I love Mariah but to say she has had a successful comeback compared to Madonna is not true. 

I’m not sure about her sales, but her reputation and current relevance is definitely surpassing Madonnas. 
And to your point, exactly. Mariah has made a comeback as Madonna never had to since she’s always been around and hasn’t reached such a deep low as Mariah did. So she should have a much easier time being successful 

[Redha DBL 7,286]

Just now, deathproof said:

Sorry, but Mariah was literally a laughing stock and written off as a messy has been a few years ago. She’s done a 360 and restored her reputation. THAT is still a comeback.

Yeah she kept low profile for a few years so people got back in love with her, but Madonna keeps on pushing the wrong buttons of people, more and more lolll...  it's like she loves to drive people mad ! She's crazy, she's Madonna. 

[Redha DBL 7,286]

I'm sure Madonna has still one big comeback up her sleeve, at least just one. She knows what she's doing. I feel like she will serve a worlwide global hit when she has decided to. She's in charge. She's a smart business woman and a bright artist, she knows when she released something dark or experimental or when she wanna go for mass success.

[deathproof 10,555]

11 minutes ago, TonyMontana said:

Yeah she kept low profile for a few years so people got back in love with her,

She didn’t keep a low profile. She worked her ass off, and gave the fans what they wanted, and delivered content that the general public enjoyed. 

[thegoldencalf 12,573]

31 minutes ago, TonyMontana said:

I'm sure Madonna has still one big comeback up her sleeve, at least just one. She knows what she's doing. I feel like she will serve a worlwide global hit when she has decided to. She's in charge. She's a smart business woman and a bright artist, she knows when she released something dark or experimental or when she wanna go for mass success.

If the biopic is done right it’s a huge opportunity for a career rejuvenation. But the second she sits down on the director chair the project will flop commercially. 

[baymad4her 1,989]

The only thing Mariah is known for, especially by younger people is her Christmas song.