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2022: Madonna's Comeback?


baymad4her
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She won’t have a comeback until she creates a new persona that people like. 
And she lost her touch for doing groundbreaking music that also relates to a huge audience.

I think Madame X is groundbreaking and well crafted but doesn’t relate to mainstream like her iconic albums 

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On 12/13/2021 at 10:14 AM, steady75 said:

I think it would be wise to let go of any chart dreams for Madonna. 

Whilst her fight against ageism is noble and right, what 12-30 year old really has any interest in that?

 When you are in the throws of youth do you really care that a 64 yr old pop star who's had everything has an issue with being overlooked for younger more relevant artists?

I'm not saying it's right or wrong I'm just saying that's the way it is.

She comes across as either wildly immature on socials or has an axe to grind about something. There's very little in between a lot of the time. Yes there's been some highly edited serves picture wise but aside from being a fascinating insight to the latter days of the worlds biggest star, she's sadly nothing more than a curio for the majority of the record buying / streaming public. They just....don't have an opinion on her cause she really holds no relevance to them.

Her last sizeable solo hit in truth was Hung Up when todays 30 year old would have been what? 12/ 13 just as that generation would have been becoming financially valid in terms of music buying / engagement then she's largely  faded into the background or seen as the older woman who came for Gaga. 

As for 30-40 they're in the work years busy living their lives and having kids (outside of the gays)..and when you're grinding hard to make ends meet in some of the toughest economic times in recent history (the last 15 years have been economically disastrous), one of the richest women in the world bemoaning on her socials or flaunting her extreme wealth, doesn't go down too well. 

40+ers will generally  remember her nostalgically but wonder "what the hell has she done to herself". I can't tell you how many people who I know who have loved her and who are sane reasonable people with a libertarian view, say this. They will want a slice of nostalgia but wouldn't be able to hum a bar of anything past 2005 and will likely only remember the last 15 years of her career for The Brits fall, Eurovision, Her ever morphing body and the Gaga comments. 

Most 60+ ers will see a peer to whom they can no longer relate. 

I'm just not sure who Madonna thinks her audience is anymore. There will always be pockets of girls and gays who shout "go on girl" " good for you" "live your best life" "yass queen" and a bunch of people who respect her choices and the voice she has given gay people, the AIDS crisis and female empowerment...but let's be honest. Madonna has started playing to the hardcore fans who buy multiple tickets in the front rows of many of her concerts...and that..isn't the general public. Whilst I have no judgement on that crowd at all..free world, you do you etc...that type of engagement will never transpose in to hitting the wider GP's pockets and hearts.

Her socials are nothing short of damaging to her career at this point and while I personally love and adore her and will ALWAYS support and follow her til the end, I am under no illusions. The general view of her is far far far from my own. More often she is simply passed on as uninteresting and "not for me" or "ugh she's at it again"

While she is on the right side of history for many many many reasons her commercial viability is......sort of lost in the wilderness a little. Bands like The Bee Gees / ABBA / Queen / Elton / Cher / Fleetwood Mac, some of whom who are still commercially active, have a great like-ability factor and the focus is largely on their past endeavours. 

I think the biopic really is her last chance to turn a tidal wave of public opinion around and in truth that's the only way to commercial success. Were in an era of like-ability more than ever....and if you don't LIKE or LOVE or FOLLOW someone..you simply don't appear in the world (socials) therefore you don't exist. 

The world has changed and I think most of the next chapters are just for us until her reappraisal happens and the bowler hat hits the stage floor for the last time.  

 

This is one of the best posts I've ever read here. You've hit every nail on the head.

I've been asking the "who exactly is her audience?" question for years now, too. If it's the general public, well, they want to hear hits. If it's the gays, they want Confessions. If it's young people, well, that's a delusional dream that needs to die. If it's the hardcore fans, then fine, give us more Madame X type albums...but sis also needs to accept that her time selling out arenas is truly over then.

I idolize, love, and defend this woman immensely in real life, but I really don't know how Madonna fans continue to be so confident that if she announces another greatest hits tour, she'll have a Confessions Tour, S&S, MDNA or, hell, even Rebel Heart success again. This woman has DESTROYED her touring reputation. Every. Single. Person. I talk to about having seen her talks about the same things: she's obscenely late, she has a bad attitude, and she doesn't do songs they want to hear. If it had been one tour, fine...but she's been doing this for almost 15 years now. She herself -- not younger popstars, not radio charts, not ticket brokers, not the audience -- has caused her touring career to be where it is, and any attempt to reverse it now feels far too little too late. 

I never meet people in real life who like her. It's almost universally a response of "oh god, Madonna?" or "I liked her 80s stuff" or "she's so embarrassing and weird now" or whatever else. So when that's the kind of response she gets by and large, how exactly does she get these people to buy an album, go to her show, or even go see the biopic? 

I'm not so convinced that she couldn't have maintained much larger success than she currently has if she hadn't gone down the route of trying hard to have Millennial / Gen Z Top 40 hits Hard Candy-onwards, remained a professional on her tours, given the general public just a little bit of what they would have liked (she did it perfectly on Confessions and S&S), and never stepped near Instagram. She isn't simply a byproduct of ageism and becoming a legacy act...Madonna was always at her best when she stayed in her own unique lane, didn't read reviews or pay attention to news, and did everything she set out to do with 100% confidence in the art. 

I hope I'm wrong. I hope she has the most legendary comeback next year or whenever she finally tries to do so. But it's been a long, long time of holding out hope for her to finally get it right again with her career, and I just don't see her ever returning from this vapid social media phase and endless babbling of "artists are here to disturb the peace". 

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She needs a reinvention in 2022 to act as damage control if we want any hope of chart success ever again. She has lost respect in the public eye. In terms of touring, a greatest hits tour that coincides with the biopic and reissues is her last real chance for a comeback. If she and her team fuck this up, It is very unlikely that she will be relevant again till she dies. I know Madonna though and I am worried that she wont reinvent because she has stopped caring as much about her career any more and seems to be going through something of a rebellious phase. And someone for the love of God, take the girls phone away! such regular use of social media has been nothing short of a disaster for her, it has ruined the mystery that was so central to Madonna's appeal and image.

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27 minutes ago, eXtremeOccident said:

This is one of the best posts I've ever read here. You've hit every nail on the head.

I've been asking the "who exactly is her audience?" question for years now, too. If it's the general public, well, they want to hear hits. If it's the gays, they want Confessions. If it's young people, well, that's a delusional dream that needs to die. If it's the hardcore fans, then fine, give us more Madame X type albums...but sis also needs to accept that her time selling out arenas is truly over then.

I idolize, love, and defend this woman immensely in real life, but I really don't know how Madonna fans continue to be so confident that if she announces another greatest hits tour, she'll have a Confessions Tour, S&S, MDNA or, hell, even Rebel Heart success again. This woman has DESTROYED her touring reputation. Every. Single. Person. I talk to about having seen her talks about the same things: she's obscenely late, she has a bad attitude, and she doesn't do songs they want to hear. If it had been one tour, fine...but she's been doing this for almost 15 years now. She herself -- not younger popstars, not radio charts, not ticket brokers, not the audience -- has caused her touring career to be where it is, and any attempt to reverse it now feels far too little too late. 

I never meet people in real life who like her. It's almost universally a response of "oh god, Madonna?" or "I liked her 80s stuff" or "she's so embarrassing and weird now" or whatever else. So when that's the kind of response she gets by and large, how exactly does she get these people to buy an album, go to her show, or even go see the biopic? 

I'm not so convinced that she couldn't have maintained much larger success than she currently has if she hadn't gone down the route of trying hard to have Millennial / Gen Z Top 40 hits Hard Candy-onwards, remained a professional on her tours, given the general public just a little bit of what they would have liked (she did it perfectly on Confessions and S&S), and never stepped near Instagram. She isn't simply a byproduct of ageism and becoming a legacy act...Madonna was always at her best when she stayed in her own unique lane, didn't read reviews or pay attention to news, and did everything she set out to do with 100% confidence in the art. 

I hope I'm wrong. I hope she has the most legendary comeback next year or whenever she finally tries to do so. But it's been a long, long time of holding out hope for her to finally get it right again with her career, and I just don't see her ever returning from this vapid social media phase and endless babbling of "artists are here to disturb the peace". 

Great messages both. I fell in love with this woman in 1999 and I would say till 2016 I have followed everystep. Last year each week I would play a tour dvd, I had forgotten the inmense performer she had been. I saw every interview and loved how articulate she was, her physical stamina, her dancing, her body, her taking care of her voice and improving, she was a role m odel for me. Now I still love her, but I don´t see those things anymore in her. I don´t think it´s age, it´s like she has changed so much I don´t recognize that artist who was a pop, a music genius, the best pop artist ever. I wish she would return to her past persona one day, and if not, I will be seeing her anyway. But she needs to revamp herself and the last thing she needs is a thing like Eurovision, that ruined her perfeccionist reputation in front of an audience of millions of people.

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17 minutes ago, Andreo said:

No offense to anyone oc, but you guys are so dramatic sometimes, seriously, reading the comments here makes me feel as happy as Jesus dying on the cross:Madonna033::Madonna033::Madonna033:

Yeah we should just all stay chill and keep looking forward to many more Eurovision performances, Instagram wars with irrelevant rappers and tracks like Bitch Im Loca. Who needs a greatest hits world tour when we all have candy shop to look forward to the rest of our lives??

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7 minutes ago, baymad4her said:

People talk a lot about the damage she's done on social media, but I don't use social media at all, so I have no idea what she's supposed to of done ?

There are ways to promote yourself without becoming an absolute joke in the process when using social media. The daily fake pictures just come across as cringe and desperate for attention. Her social media is regarded as a joke by everyone I have ever talked with that is not an ultra stan. The same old artists are here to disturb the peace bullshit is getting very old, nobody is disturbed or outraged by her social media, they just like mock it and troll. I am just really hoping for a reinvention in 2022, I dont think I can survive another year of Madame X.

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2 minutes ago, Ziggy Stardust said:

There are ways to promote yourself without becoming an absolute joke in the process when using social media. The daily fake pictures just come across as cringe and desperate for attention. Her social media is regarded as a joke by everyone I have ever talked with that is not an ultra stan. The same old artists are here to disturb the peace bullshit is getting very old, nobody is disturbed or outraged by her social media, they just like mock it and troll. I am just really hoping for a reinvention in 2022, I dont think I can survive another year of Madame X.

I heard Madonna was supposed to stuck under a bed, but I have no idea what that's about.

I agree with you about Madame X, I was over that as soon as she released that awful album.

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On 12/13/2021 at 10:14 AM, steady75 said:

I think it would be wise to let go of any chart dreams for Madonna. 

Whilst her fight against ageism is noble and right, what 12-30 year old really has any interest in that?

 When you are in the throws of youth do you really care that a 64 yr old pop star who's had everything has an issue with being overlooked for younger more relevant artists?

I'm not saying it's right or wrong I'm just saying that's the way it is.

She comes across as either wildly immature on socials or has an axe to grind about something. There's very little in between a lot of the time. Yes there's been some highly edited serves picture wise but aside from being a fascinating insight to the latter days of the worlds biggest star, she's sadly nothing more than a curio for the majority of the record buying / streaming public. They just....don't have an opinion on her cause she really holds no relevance to them.

Her last sizeable solo hit in truth was Hung Up when todays 30 year old would have been what? 12/ 13 just as that generation would have been becoming financially valid in terms of music buying / engagement then she's largely  faded into the background or seen as the older woman who came for Gaga. 

As for 30-40 they're in the work years busy living their lives and having kids (outside of the gays)..and when you're grinding hard to make ends meet in some of the toughest economic times in recent history (the last 15 years have been economically disastrous), one of the richest women in the world bemoaning on her socials or flaunting her extreme wealth, doesn't go down too well. 

40+ers will generally  remember her nostalgically but wonder "what the hell has she done to herself". I can't tell you how many people who I know who have loved her and who are sane reasonable people with a libertarian view, say this. They will want a slice of nostalgia but wouldn't be able to hum a bar of anything past 2005 and will likely only remember the last 15 years of her career for The Brits fall, Eurovision, Her ever morphing body and the Gaga comments. 

Most 60+ ers will see a peer to whom they can no longer relate. 

I'm just not sure who Madonna thinks her audience is anymore. There will always be pockets of girls and gays who shout "go on girl" " good for you" "live your best life" "yass queen" and a bunch of people who respect her choices and the voice she has given gay people, the AIDS crisis and female empowerment...but let's be honest. Madonna has started playing to the hardcore fans who buy multiple tickets in the front rows of many of her concerts...and that..isn't the general public. Whilst I have no judgement on that crowd at all..free world, you do you etc...that type of engagement will never transpose in to hitting the wider GP's pockets and hearts.

Her socials are nothing short of damaging to her career at this point and while I personally love and adore her and will ALWAYS support and follow her til the end, I am under no illusions. The general view of her is far far far from my own. More often she is simply passed on as uninteresting and "not for me" or "ugh she's at it again"

While she is on the right side of history for many many many reasons her commercial viability is......sort of lost in the wilderness a little. Bands like The Bee Gees / ABBA / Queen / Elton / Cher / Fleetwood Mac, some of whom who are still commercially active, have a great like-ability factor and the focus is largely on their past endeavours. 

I think the biopic really is her last chance to turn a tidal wave of public opinion around and in truth that's the only way to commercial success. Were in an era of like-ability more than ever....and if you don't LIKE or LOVE or FOLLOW someone..you simply don't appear in the world (socials) therefore you don't exist. 

The world has changed and I think most of the next chapters are just for us until her reappraisal happens and the bowler hat hits the stage floor for the last time.  

 

I live for your comments. Always spot on. No disrespect. Just totally realistic and honest. And I have said it a million times, but "seen as the older woman who came for Gaga"...THIS did way more damage with younger audiences than the fandom would like to believe. 

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On 12/13/2021 at 3:14 PM, steady75 said:

I think it would be wise to let go of any chart dreams for Madonna. 

Whilst her fight against ageism is noble and right, what 12-30 year old really has any interest in that?

 When you are in the throws of youth do you really care that a 64 yr old pop star who's had everything has an issue with being overlooked for younger more relevant artists?

I'm not saying it's right or wrong I'm just saying that's the way it is.

She comes across as either wildly immature on socials or has an axe to grind about something. There's very little in between a lot of the time. Yes there's been some highly edited serves picture wise but aside from being a fascinating insight to the latter days of the worlds biggest star, she's sadly nothing more than a curio for the majority of the record buying / streaming public. They just....don't have an opinion on her cause she really holds no relevance to them.

Her last sizeable solo hit in truth was Hung Up when todays 30 year old would have been what? 12/ 13 just as that generation would have been becoming financially valid in terms of music buying / engagement then she's largely  faded into the background or seen as the older woman who came for Gaga. 

As for 30-40 they're in the work years busy living their lives and having kids (outside of the gays)..and when you're grinding hard to make ends meet in some of the toughest economic times in recent history (the last 15 years have been economically disastrous), one of the richest women in the world bemoaning on her socials or flaunting her extreme wealth, doesn't go down too well. 

40+ers will generally  remember her nostalgically but wonder "what the hell has she done to herself". I can't tell you how many people who I know who have loved her and who are sane reasonable people with a libertarian view, say this. They will want a slice of nostalgia but wouldn't be able to hum a bar of anything past 2005 and will likely only remember the last 15 years of her career for The Brits fall, Eurovision, Her ever morphing body and the Gaga comments. 

Most 60+ ers will see a peer to whom they can no longer relate. 

I'm just not sure who Madonna thinks her audience is anymore. There will always be pockets of girls and gays who shout "go on girl" " good for you" "live your best life" "yass queen" and a bunch of people who respect her choices and the voice she has given gay people, the AIDS crisis and female empowerment...but let's be honest. Madonna has started playing to the hardcore fans who buy multiple tickets in the front rows of many of her concerts...and that..isn't the general public. Whilst I have no judgement on that crowd at all..free world, you do you etc...that type of engagement will never transpose in to hitting the wider GP's pockets and hearts.

Her socials are nothing short of damaging to her career at this point and while I personally love and adore her and will ALWAYS support and follow her til the end, I am under no illusions. The general view of her is far far far from my own. More often she is simply passed on as uninteresting and "not for me" or "ugh she's at it again"

While she is on the right side of history for many many many reasons her commercial viability is......sort of lost in the wilderness a little. Bands like The Bee Gees / ABBA / Queen / Elton / Cher / Fleetwood Mac, some of whom who are still commercially active, have a great like-ability factor and the focus is largely on their past endeavours. 

I think the biopic really is her last chance to turn a tidal wave of public opinion around and in truth that's the only way to commercial success. Were in an era of like-ability more than ever....and if you don't LIKE or LOVE or FOLLOW someone..you simply don't appear in the world (socials) therefore you don't exist. 

The world has changed and I think most of the next chapters are just for us until her reappraisal happens and the bowler hat hits the stage floor for the last time.  

 

Agree with you & XtremeOccident  , there’s also been a lot of things that Hardcore fans are pissed off with , last minute cancellations ,  late starts,  major loss of money, shortened shows , lack of variation of old songs , sound issues, and how many Front Row Hard Core Fans are there now ??  Shall we make a list ? 

And anyways Madonna said this herself just a couple of months ago in V magazine

 

M: I could have done a stadium tour, greatest hits, and made a billion dollars.

JOH: You’re the most successful touring musician of all time, male or female.

M: Right. So I could have done that, but there would have been no joy in it for me. I just don’t like the idea of repeating myself. I don’t like the idea of giving the people what they want. I’ll give them a little bit of what they want, and then I’m going to give them some other stuff.

I DON”T LIKE THE IDEA OF GIVING THE PEOPLE WHAT THEY WANT !!!!!

Who knows ..  she’s knows what we want cause we’re not been getting it !! If we get dud re-issues then we’ll know for sure.

 

 

 

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I think a lot of the problem stems from how she chooses to present herself. 
Its  faux controversy or childish silliness or the tortured misunderstood artist. Always going left JUST because you she thinks you expect her to go right. It’s all very second guessy and contrarian for the sake of it. She’s almost morphed into the the things that critics typically say about artists. 
 

Nothing feels organic and everything is either hyper curated and edited or wildly random or off the cuff which comes across as oddly childish and insincere or off the mark. 
The saddest thing is there seems so little Joy. The kind you can feel through the lens at least. 
 

I loved watching the Madame X tour DVD and she seemed super super present again and the whole film made me understand the whole era as a package… but if I’m following every single beat and only really “get it” at the end of the two year project cycle what then hell are the locals getting from it. 
 

Bullet proof melodies, a large dose of carefree joy and some cool everyday outfits rather than restrictive or revealing showpiece costumes would do her next era the world of good. Madonna as the every woman who can again in a small way. 
No capes, bustiers, eyepatches, bolero jackets. Sexy, softer and cool. I still live for baby Pink BBQ shoot she did. Best thing in years. I’d take a whole era of that sort of energy. That’s Madonna 2021/2. Not the MTV awards gal. 
 

Sort of remade 80’s Madonna energy for the 20’s.. and by that I mean effortlessly cool and alone. There’s always so many people around her, it’s claustrophobic. 


Im still not entirely sure this whole decade isn’t Madonna putting us as great distance purposely and her entire social media and public appearance strategy is part of some higher social experiment strategy she plans to use later, or maybe she thinks it will protect her in some way. If she builds her own ridiculous annoying curated monster that’s not real the comments can’t hurt her and we don’t know what’s really real. There’s a MJ and Prince element to it. I dunno. She’s a clever one so I wouldn’t put it past her. We’ll see I suppose.

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3 hours ago, Ziggy Stardust said:

Yeah we should just all stay chill and keep looking forward to many more Eurovision performances, Instagram wars with irrelevant rappers and tracks like Bitch Im Loca. Who needs a greatest hits world tour when we all have candy shop to look forward to the rest of our lives??

I've never said that actually? :confused:

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I'm just grateful she is healthy and being creative. Regarding her behaviour and choices, she's an artist and most cannot relate. Her mind is abstract and active conceptually. Constantly looking ahead and living in the moment. I enjoy her social media participation as it documents her trajectory and day to day. I think we're entering a new phase in her life where she'll want to be more retrospective, but I have a feeling she'll expand on her trace and keep it fresh rather than doing what others do. 

Regarding future music projects, I wish she either works with someone new for an entire record (like Sufjan Stevens, Honey Dijon, Dessner Brothers, Perfume Genius) or teams up with some totally unexpected artist for an album collaboration--produced by them, written with them, and has Madonna on all main vocals (such as Pet Shop Boys, Everything but the Girl, Patti Smith, Alanis Morissette, or maybe even more of Lenny Kravitz).

But I'm looking forward to the reissues and re-releases in the New Year. Hopefully there will be some unexpected surprises and new stuff as well.

As for live performances, I'm enjoying the recent smaller intimate and artistic moments! Even if they are not accessible to all, we can still witness from a distance and virtually.

I don't think charts and awards are important anymore as most are paid for and hardly celebrate artistry and full merit. 

I love artists like Pet Shop Boys, David Bowie and Patti Smith whom have generated music projects into a continuous and lifelong art form and presented their work in interesting formats, alternate venues, museums and art centres--that included fascinating visuals, fashion and collectables. Hopefully Madonna will continue to push forward in this direction.

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3 hours ago, Rainbow said:

Agree with you & XtremeOccident  , there’s also been a lot of things that Hardcore fans are pissed off with , last minute cancellations ,  late starts,  major loss of money, shortened shows , lack of variation of old songs , sound issues, and how many Front Row Hard Core Fans are there now ??  Shall we make a list ? 

And anyways Madonna said this herself just a couple of months ago in V magazine

 

M: I could have done a stadium tour, greatest hits, and made a billion dollars.

JOH: You’re the most successful touring musician of all time, male or female.

M: Right. So I could have done that, but there would have been no joy in it for me. I just don’t like the idea of repeating myself. I don’t like the idea of giving the people what they want. I’ll give them a little bit of what they want, and then I’m going to give them some other stuff.

I DON”T LIKE THE IDEA OF GIVING THE PEOPLE WHAT THEY WANT !!!!!

And that really sums it up. Even though she said this recently I don’t see her sticking to that flop approach. She has been known to do a 180 on that attitude numerous times in her career. The fact she’s doing a biopic and reissues says a lot about what’s next I think (or hope.)

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The more I have been thinking about this whole comeback topic, the more doubtful I am becoming that it will happen. First lets talk about the biopic, the fact that Madonna herself is directing it means that it is bound to be slammed by critics and the storyline will be told from her own point of view which is a recipe for disaster. she has never had tons of success with her movies but could afford it back then when she was still very relevant. The reissues are something that concerns fans and not the general public as much. The only real way I can see a comeback happening is if she somehow has a commercially successful album again and that will not be possible unless she has a reinvention and revives her tarnished image, which is going to be much harder now that she is in her 60's because of ageism. It was amazing that she was able to bounce back from Erotica, dont know it will happen again.

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I remember when I was younger, listening to the charts, waiting to see what number Madonna was going to enter at. I was ecstatic when "Frozen" went straight in at number one in the UK singles chart, I was jumping up and down all over the room. I just want to have that once more.

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Some of you speak like she suddenly was a forgotten indie artist with no sales and touring in pubs. But her last studio album was an US #1 and UK #2 and her last tour another success.

Who's her audience? Think of your past Madonna concerts and look around you. Her audience is everyone: the core of it are gay men and women, but also general public, parents with kids, families, etc. That's the beauty of her power and her legacy: music makes the people come together, etc.

No matter what happens, she's always gonna be Madonna and have the amazing legacy she has. She's a living legend, there will always be people interested in what she does. The moment she decides to announce a Greatest Hits tour (if she does ever) it will be a great success. BUT that would be her "playing the game" and we know she doesn't like to do that often.

Some of you are asking her to be different and innovative but playing that game at the same time. And that is a contradiction.

It's not realistic expecting her to be a 20-30 year old version of herself, though, as a touring and commercial force. This is another phase of her life and if you expect that, you're setting yourselves up for disappointment.

Enjoy and appreciate she's still alive and creative and now celebrate her legacy with the reissues and the movie.

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I would love nothing more than to see Madonna back on top of the charts believe me, but the real question is, does Madonna want that as bad as the fans do? if so, she has not shown it in recent years. I am just seeing the time slip away and if she is going to make a comeback, it better be fucking  soon and the only way that it might be possible to achieve that, will be applying the things I outlined in previous comments, because she sure as Hades is not going to make a comeback with her current behavior.  

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