Was Gambler originally planned to be released in the US?

[deathproof 10,588]

Came across this poster today.

 

Its advertising a sneak preview for Vision Quest during screenings of Night Patrol.

Night Patrol came out November 1984. Vision Quest came out Feb 1985.

As far as I know, Crazy For You was released March 1985.

But look at the billing block in the poster advertisement:

“Featuring MADONNA performing her new hit song GAMBLER”

Which begs the question…,

did they originally plan back in 1984 when this sneak preview came out for Gambler to be the lead single?

Why would the poster advertise Gambler and not Crazy For You?

[A. A. Aardvark 4,838]

no

[deathproof 10,588]

17 minutes ago, professormouse said:

no

Why do you say that?

[Enrico 15,792]

Imagine if they said "performing the hit song Warning Signs"!

I think it's possible. After all, at the time they didn't know LAV album and singles would be so successful that Warner blocked the release of Gambler.

[A. A. Aardvark 4,838]

4 hours ago, deathproof said:

Why do you say that?

'coz at one time people did say "Madonna 'who' ?"
 

[Roland Barthes 5,836]

In Siren Song, Seymour Stein says that Jon Peters (the one Bradley Cooper portrays in Licorice Pizza) the producer of Vision Quest went to Mo Ostin (warner boss at the time) office and threatned to punch him in the face if he did not allow Geffen to release Crazy For you. Ostin thought there were too many Madonna singles out. So the deal was Crazy For You would be the only release from the soundtrack in the US.

[jemboy1973 663]

I didn't realise until the internet years that it was not released in the USA as it was a reasonably big hit here in the UK.

I was quite obsessed with it at the time. It was on a jukebox and I nearly got punched in the face for playing it repeatedly. 

I do hope it gets some recognition with the upcoming re-releases, but won't be surprised if it doesn't. 

[wtg1987 10,159]

We were really spoiled in the U.K. getting this as a single and into the groove - we got nice vinyl releases too and I loved the artwork too - I have gambler sheet music and it’s one of my favourites . I can only think it wasn’t released because Warner didn’t want any songs to interfere with LAV album sales sane as into the groove 

[Rocco Comelon 5,252]

I love this single, really suitable for the Vision Quest Soundtrack as it is a workout kind of song

[Nowheretohide 249]

Probably there were initial doubts if publish Gambler or Crazy for you as single in the US. If I remember correctly, exists a double-A side promo 7"  with Crazy for you on one side and Gambler on the other, later reprinted in the series of "back to back hits". Luckily for Europe, we got both songs released as separate singles with the great remix of Gambler by Jellybean Benitez...

Edited January 29, 2022 by Nowheretohide (see edit history)

[Alfalfa_HampusFL 1,138]

Gambler has always been one of my fave Madonna songs... good that it was released as a single here... but I guess the lack of attention it has since gotten is closely connected with it not being a single in the US.

[Enrico 15,792]

2 hours ago, HampusFL said:

Gambler has always been one of my fave Madonna songs... good that it was released as a single her... but I guess the lack of attention it has since gotten is closely connected with it not being a single in the US.

Exactly, I wish she had performed it instead of Burning Up (although it was very good) during RHT... I think it would make a perfect "Madonna on guitar song"!

[A. A. Aardvark 4,838]

12 hours ago, jemboy1973 said:

I didn't realise until the internet years that it was not released in the USA as it was a reasonably big hit here in the UK.

I was quite obsessed with it at the time. It was on a jukebox and I nearly got punched in the face for playing it repeatedly. 

I do hope it gets some recognition with the upcoming re-releases, but won't be surprised if it doesn't. 

Can someone hold the ankle-biters back while I get my zimmer through........

[Alpha 1,175]

Always hated this song. When i think of bad 80s music this is one song i instantly picture. Same as Cant Stop Jimmy Jimmy and Love Makes the World Go Round.

[Régine Filange 2,582]

its sad that songs like gambler and into the groove werent released in US, they were def top 10 hits

[50ft Queenie 2,787]

3 minutes ago, Régine Filange said:

its sad that songs like gambler and into the groove werent released in US, they were def top 10 hits

Into The Groove deserved to be a top ten hit, not so sure about Gambler. In the 80's anything Madonna released could have been a top ten hit.

[Régine Filange 2,582]

1 hour ago, Prince of Darkness said:

Into The Groove deserved to be a top ten hit, not so sure about Gambler. In the 80's anything Madonna released could have been a top ten hit.

why not? its very catchy

[Karma 2,818]

1 hour ago, Régine Filange said:

its sad that songs like gambler and into the groove werent released in US, they were def top 10 hits

Totally. I bet "Into The Groove" would've gone #1 on the Hot 100, she had that Midas touch in the 80s.

I think her U.S label was too conservative. They wanted to avoid "overexposure" and were afraid that her soundtrack singles would overshadow the Like A Virgin campaign. Ideally,  they should have reissued the album with "Groove", "Crazy" and "Gambler" to maximize its sales.

In the U.K, they made the right call capitalizing on the huge demand, her 1985 chart run is nothing short of incredible. 

January: #3 Like A Virgin

March: #3 Material Girl

June: #2 Crazy For You

July: #1 Into The Groove

August: #2 Holiday (Re-Entry)

September: #5 Angel

October: #4 Gambler

December: #5 Dress You Up

January '86: #2 Borderline (Re-Entry)

[A. A. Aardvark 4,838]

On 1/29/2022 at 2:51 AM, Roland Barthes said:

In Siren Song, Seymour Stein says that Jon Peters (the one Bradley Cooper portrays in Licorice Pizza) the producer of Vision Quest went to Mo Ostin (warner boss at the time) office and threatned to punch him in the face if he did not allow Geffen to release Crazy For you. Ostin thought there were too many Madonna singles out. So the deal was Crazy For You would be the only release from the soundtrack in the US.

......in America.

[scamper 1,989]

I remember reading in the early 90s (when "The Immaculate Collection" was released) that Warner didn't want Geffen to release the singles of "Vision quest" and that they thought that "Crazy for you" was a risk because it was a song completly different to what Madonna was releasing with them. Maybe before they made the final decission "Gambler" was the one chosen as a single but who knows. 

I've always find interesting this kind of stories, specially the ones from the Madonna/Virgin era. Now with Internet we have access to a lot of information that in the 80's was completly unknown. Maybe we'll get an answer on her biopic :P

[Roland Barthes 5,836]

13 minutes ago, scamper said:

I remember reading in the early 90s (when "The Immaculate Collection" was released) that Warner didn't want Geffen to release the singles of "Vision quest" and that they thought that "Crazy for you" was a risk because it was a song completly different to what Madonna was releasing with them. Maybe before they made the final decission "Gambler" was the one chosen as a single but who knows. 

I've always find interesting this kind of stories, specially the ones from the Madonna/Virgin era. Now with Internet we have access to a lot of information that in the 80's was completly unknown. Maybe we'll get an answer on her biopic :P

In Siren Song, again, Seymour Stein recalls that Mo Ostin had invested a lot of money on Like A Virgin. Prior to the success of the first album Warner did not care about Madonna. Suddenly they were all over her. Initially the follow up was to be produced by Madonna, Bray & Jellybean but Mo Ostin wanted a big producer (just like Michael Rosenblatt forced her to work with Reggie Lucas because he wanted an R&B sound...Yes Rayoflighters, Madonna's first producer was an R&B producer). Madonna wanted Nile Rodgers because of Let's Dance or Trevor Horn because of FGTH. Nile Rodgers asked for $ 2 million to produce the album. Warner agreed and wanted Madonna to pay for it herself, meaning she would not make money with the record. Seymour Stein fought that battle for her so Warner paid Rodgers. So when Geffen wanted to release the Vision Quest ost tracks as singles all hell broke lose, Ostin was already mad about "Into The Groove" not being on Like A Virgin, the album they wanted to sale and now they had another track out there not on the album. Since Vision Quest was a Warner Bros. movie but the OST was distributed by Geffen, Jon Peters, the movie producer, sensing he had a great exposure for the movie with Madonna being the superstar of 1985 went to Mo Ostin and things heated up. 

In the end, Jon Peters had his way. And Madonna finally was allowed to produce her own stuff thanks to Into The Groove and for less money than Nile Rodgers (who is overrated as a producer, LAV is not Madonna's best, Let's Dance is probably one of Bowie's worst and Diana Ross remixed her album herself with a Motown engineer because it sucked. You can compare both versions, the released one we all know remixed by Diana and the Chic produced version which is lifeless)

[PlayPause 2,683]

23 hours ago, Roland Barthes said:

Nile Rodgers (who is overrated as a producer

So overrated that they were all fighting to have him in the studio.

All those albums were global hits that revived Ross's & Bowie's solo career, and confirmed M as one the 80's top act.

I'd love to be such an untalented musician ?

[MaDöner Kebab 6,873]

On 1/29/2022 at 3:51 AM, Roland Barthes said:

In Siren Song, Seymour Stein says that Jon Peters (the one Bradley Cooper portrays in Licorice Pizza) the producer of Vision Quest went to Mo Ostin (warner boss at the time) office and threatned to punch him in the face if he did not allow Geffen to release Crazy For you. Ostin thought there were too many Madonna singles out. So the deal was Crazy For You would be the only release from the soundtrack in the US.

In fact, I think Sire did not want ANY singles from Vision Quest to overshadow the singles from Like a Virgin.

AND THEY WERE RIGHT cause Into the Groove, Crazy for You and to a certain extend Gambler really overshadowed Angel and the possibility of more LAV singles (Over and Over and Love Don't Live Here Anymore).

I think they were gonna push for the two above had Crazy for You and Gambler not happened. They tested those two singles in selected territories in 1986 to see if they did anything on the chart but then just abandoned them cause Madonna was already preparing for True Blue.

[Roland Barthes 5,836]

3 hours ago, PlayPause said:

So overrated that they were all fighting to have him in the studio.

All those albums were global hits that revived Ross's & Bowie's solo career, and confirmed M as one the 80's top act.

I'd love to be such an untalented musician ?

qualitywise it's overrated to the max. Very few Madonna fans would say Like a virgin is her best album, even Rodgers said so. Let's Dance was the begining of the end for Bowie. And as for Diana Ross, compare both versions, the one we all know she remixed herself and the one Edwards & Rodgers did that is now available as a bonus : flat as a pancake. And let's not forget the absolute fail that was Kookoo, the first Debbie Harry solo album they produced. And to close that string of passable albums Rodgers had his hands on there's also the one he did for Grace Jones. Hardly her best either. So yes, he is overrated as a producer but the Chic albums are great.SorryNotSorry

[PlayPause 2,683]

2 hours ago, Roland Barthes said:

qualitywise it's overrated to the max. Very few Madonna fans would say Like a virgin is her best album, even Rodgers said so. Let's Dance was the begining of the end for Bowie. And as for Diana Ross, compare both versions, the one we all know she remixed herself and the one Edwards & Rodgers did that is now available as a bonus : flat as a pancake. And let's not forget the absolute fail that was Kookoo, the first Debbie Harry solo album they produced. And to close that string of passable albums Rodgers had his hands on there's also the one he did for Grace Jones. Hardly her best either. So yes, he is overrated as a producer but the Chic albums are great.SorryNotSorry

I get you don't like his work, and I agree that every album he produced isn't unforgettable. You can't dismiss him and his influence just because you think it's "not quality"... As a musician, as a guitarist, as a producer, as a songwriter, as a studio partner, Nile Rodgers was A-list in the late 70s and early 80s, whether you like or not.

A big chunk of the music from these times may sound "dated" or "subpar" because standards have changed so much, sonically, artistically and technically speaking.

Back in those days, he was a hitmaker, and that's why they hired him. Upside Down, Let's Dance and LAV were HUMONGOUS hits. Mission accomplished.

Personally, I like a lot better the Chic Mix of Diana Ross's album. I don't think I have listened to the regular version in decades. You say it's flat, I say it's more organic and less radio-friendly than the commercial mix.

Anyway, Gambler didn't come from the sessions with Nile Rodgers so I'm not sure why we're talking about this here.