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Madonna & Tokischa - Hung Up Remix Music Video


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5 hours ago, Pootz333 said:

Someone mentioned that kids going crazy for Madonna today would have been like kids in the 80's going crazy for Peggy Lee. I was not prepared for that comparison at all.

I don’t think it’s an accurate comparison. What Madonna did in the 80’s and 90’s is everywhere in todays pop culture. Along with a few other icons she is the blueprint.

The fact so many young kids don’t recognize that or care is unbearable for a lot of fans. As we can see in this thread.

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I love how Madonna keeps exposing how conservative people truly are and especially people who think they are not. 

Here comes the essay, run for your life !

I remember an argument i had here with a member about Papa Don't Preach, i've never liked how she chose to keep the baby in the song, someone here made me see another point of view, like she cornered the moral majority about admitting kids were having sex. Of course i disagreed and argued but it stayed in the back of my mind and i totally see it now. 

I don't know about you but she makes me feel uncomfortable and i'm what most would call an annoying woke leftist. And i wondered why it not only made me feel uncomfortable but angry too. I understand that it is because she's pushing me out of my comfort zone. I love her so i defend her but do i like what she's been doing lately ? Instantly, no but i always (well most of the time) grow to enjoy her last input when every has settled down or, more likely, when i finally keep up with her.

That video is like she's going out of her way to not please anyone. Like she's going in the opposite direction of what is expected of her. I'm not sure it is what she would be doing if the reactions were positive, just like with Erotica or Justify My Love she keeps winking and laughing, in this one she at times seems to be wondering what she's doing there, it's a joke. She made herself look like the clown from Tears Of A Clown. The lack of eyebrows does not suit her, i did not even like it 30 years ago. The grillz etc...she's not trying to look pretty, like she makes herself looks scary, monster like...and yet in pure Madonna style (meaning being confusing) she overphotoshops herself to look "pretty". She wants to be challenging and she is. In the end it's not what she does that is interesting but th reaction to it. Mine first, because it makes me ask myself why i have these reactions and what is she triggering in me. I then realize that has much as when i was a little boy and a teenager she pushes "over the borderline" and forces to grow, to be accepting. The reactions from people, even die hard fans is even more interesting. She's not killing anyone, she's not making trumpist statements, she's, on the contrary, being very open and inclusive and it seems like people don't like that and even people who are themselves unconventional. Gays mostly. I see the body shaming, the misogyny, the conservatism etc...i see it everyday in them and not just regarding Madonna. I love she's finally antagonizing them. Well not all of them but that damn "Ikea" fringe of the community. It's ok for a man to do drag, not for a woman. I got it a while ago. Women must either be perfect goddesses or ugly sexless friends. She made herself scary ugly looking and oversexed. She's 64, she shoulf be wearing a princess dress, beautiful and not revealing, and sing ballads about love or a disco song while dresses sexy but not sexual, "classy" like they say, because that's what makes people comfortable, they don't like to be challenged because they don't want to realize their own hypocrisy, while they are asking to be accepted the way they are, they still refuse to accept others the same way too. I've realized we all want the world and others to stay in their lane and the world to be the way we want it to be, meaning like us. 

This last impersonation of Madonna makes me think of Divine. She's pushing the limits of taste and if she's not convincing anyone, because she's so extreme, she's at least exposing how intolerant we are, especially people who like to think they are progressive. I don't care she makes the moral majority and proud conservatives mad or mocking her. It's a given and they probably don't care anymore. Nope, what's interesting lately is how she'exposing progressive people,because she's Madonna, for whatever reasons, what they are willing to accept from someone else or want others to accept from them, they violently refuse it from her, even her fans. And that's what i like about art. For me it was never about how pretty it is but the reaction i have to it and the reaction of others. 

She shakes our molecules. That's how all matters evolve wether it's conscious or unconscious. It's a reaction. 

 

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1 hour ago, Roland Barthes said:

She shakes our molecules. That's how all matters evolve wether it's conscious or unconscious. It's a reaction. 

 

To be honest I think you are overthinking everything... not sure why? why do you need everything Madonna does to be groundbreaking or boundary pushing?? or need to explain it like it is??

Why is it not ok for Madonna just to make a song and a video... that says something about where she is in life at the point of time when it is made? Now she is hanging around a bunch of younger artist... who is into the style of things she is doing now... they influence her to do similar things... Does everything Madonna does need to be seen from larger motives, she wants to teach us, she wants to show the world etc. etc?

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18 minutes ago, HampusFL said:

To be honest I think you are overthinking everything... not sure why? why do you need everything Madonna does to be groundbreaking or boundary pushing?? or need to explain it like it is??

Why is it not ok for Madonna just to make a song and a video... that says something about where she is in life at the point of time when it is made? Now she is hanging around a bunch of younger artist... who is into the style of things she is doing now... they influence her to do similar things... Does everything Madonna does need to be seen from larger motives, she wants to teach us, she wants to show the world etc. etc?

I've never said it was conscious. I just watch the reactions, mine and of others and wonder why. But you can also just enjoy the music, it's a great remix. 

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31 minutes ago, Blue Jean said:

Are these stats good? How do they compare to Medellin or the Frozen stuff?

They're OK - so far, audio's been out for a week and the video for 5 days. The song is doing 75.000-100.000 streams a day on Spotify now, which is not amazing but quite healthy. But the video is slowing down quite a bit now. So we'll see but it's not looking that promising now.

To compare, "Medellín" is the most streamed song of the "Madame X" album, with 65M streams on Spotify since its release, while the video is 55M on YouTube. That's not a giant hit by any means, but it's OK.

"Frozen" Sickick worked very great on Spotify, at least the original first remix: it's almost 93M streams now. It had the support of big Spotify playlists like Viral Hits, Big On Internet, etc. etc. (the TikTok effect).

The remixes videos did not that great in the long run: the Fireboy DML Remix is at 12M, 070 Shake remix at 2M and "Frozen On Fire" 2,6M.

Tokischa, while not a big big artist, is quite known in Latin countries, so that should give the "Hung Up" remix certain longevity. We'll see.

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12 hours ago, Sultrysully said:

Madonna has nothing to prove to anyone older or younger than 30 years of age.  Every single stream and sale adds to her history making career.   She is a Queen.  

She didn’t get the memo babes. I’m not Interested in whether she still feels the need to prove anything or not. That’s her business not mine.  Though years of being a fan leads me to think otherwise. While in principal this is absolutely true In reality I think it’s naive to think this is her state of mind. Madonna to the grave and beyond will need to be loved. There’ll never be enough love. Finally or not. 

She’ll certainly be able to hear your screams of “yasss queen icon bitch creamy pop goddess slay” in empty stadiums. So keep it up hen.
 

Again I joke. I couple of years back I had a similar tone to yours when defending her to a long time hardcore Madonna fan who simply felt that : Not only had he stopped liking her musical and visual content but that her social optics, the current day version of herself and intent with which she projects her self onto the world seems jarring and at odds with all previous incarnations of her. I pointed out she’d always been hypocritical at points throughout her career. His response was something along the lines of “her contradictions seemed intentional and added to her mystery and allure, now they undermine her”

I could tell this was someone who wasn’t for bringing back into the fold. After much of me going “but this but that” His closing statement was “at the end of the day I didn’t abandon Madonna she abandoned me”

Which whether he was right or wrong really wasn’t the point, it’s how he felt. “She’s a pop star, people switch off but she’s actively helping them reach for the plug”

I sipped my g&t and changed the subject to the Brexit crisis. It seems less incendiary. 
 

 

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3 hours ago, Roland Barthes said:

I love how Madonna keeps exposing how conservative people truly are and especially people who think they are not. 

Here comes the essay, run for your life !

I remember an argument i had here with a member about Papa Don't Preach, i've never liked how she chose to keep the baby in the song, someone here made me see another point of view, like she cornered the moral majority about admitting kids were having sex. Of course i disagreed and argued but it stayed in the back of my mind and i totally see it now. 

I don't know about you but she makes me feel uncomfortable and i'm what most would call an annoying woke leftist. And i wondered why it not only made me feel uncomfortable but angry too. I understand that it is because she's pushing me out of my comfort zone. I love her so i defend her but do i like what she's been doing lately ? Instantly, no but i always (well most of the time) grow to enjoy her last input when every has settled down or, more likely, when i finally keep up with her.

That video is like she's going out of her way to not please anyone. Like she's going in the opposite direction of what is expected of her. I'm not sure it is what she would be doing if the reactions were positive, just like with Erotica or Justify My Love she keeps winking and laughing, in this one she at times seems to be wondering what she's doing there, it's a joke. She made herself look like the clown from Tears Of A Clown. The lack of eyebrows does not suit her, i did not even like it 30 years ago. The grillz etc...she's not trying to look pretty, like she makes herself looks scary, monster like...and yet in pure Madonna style (meaning being confusing) she overphotoshops herself to look "pretty". She wants to be challenging and she is. In the end it's not what she does that is interesting but th reaction to it. Mine first, because it makes me ask myself why i have these reactions and what is she triggering in me. I then realize that has much as when i was a little boy and a teenager she pushes "over the borderline" and forces to grow, to be accepting. The reactions from people, even die hard fans is even more interesting. She's not killing anyone, she's not making trumpist statements, she's, on the contrary, being very open and inclusive and it seems like people don't like that and even people who are themselves unconventional. Gays mostly. I see the body shaming, the misogyny, the conservatism etc...i see it everyday in them and not just regarding Madonna. I love she's finally antagonizing them. Well not all of them but that damn "Ikea" fringe of the community. It's ok for a man to do drag, not for a woman. I got it a while ago. Women must either be perfect goddesses or ugly sexless friends. She made herself scary ugly looking and oversexed. She's 64, she shoulf be wearing a princess dress, beautiful and not revealing, and sing ballads about love or a disco song while dresses sexy but not sexual, "classy" like they say, because that's what makes people comfortable, they don't like to be challenged because they don't want to realize their own hypocrisy, while they are asking to be accepted the way they are, they still refuse to accept others the same way too. I've realized we all want the world and others to stay in their lane and the world to be the way we want it to be, meaning like us. 

This last impersonation of Madonna makes me think of Divine. She's pushing the limits of taste and if she's not convincing anyone, because she's so extreme, she's at least exposing how intolerant we are, especially people who like to think they are progressive. I don't care she makes the moral majority and proud conservatives mad or mocking her. It's a given and they probably don't care anymore. Nope, what's interesting lately is how she'exposing progressive people,because she's Madonna, for whatever reasons, what they are willing to accept from someone else or want others to accept from them, they violently refuse it from her, even her fans. And that's what i like about art. For me it was never about how pretty it is but the reaction i have to it and the reaction of others. 

She shakes our molecules. That's how all matters evolve wether it's conscious or unconscious. It's a reaction. 

 

I don’t disagree with much of this tbh. I’m all for those questions and observations. But sometimes bad art is just bad art and trying to intellectualise it is actually a disservice to art and genuine artistic intent and the value and importance of that. Especially from a former titan and expert of that particular brand of art as a force for change like Madonna. 
 

I do take exception to branding anyone who doesn’t get it or appreciate it or think the same way as conservative. One might brand that as having fascist leanings but I wouldn’t say that because it could be deemed as harsh as the statement I’m pushing against. 

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3 hours ago, Roland Barthes said:

I love how Madonna keeps exposing how conservative people truly are and especially people who think they are not. 

Here comes the essay, run for your life !

I remember an argument i had here with a member about Papa Don't Preach, i've never liked how she chose to keep the baby in the song, someone here made me see another point of view, like she cornered the moral majority about admitting kids were having sex. Of course i disagreed and argued but it stayed in the back of my mind and i totally see it now. 

I don't know about you but she makes me feel uncomfortable and i'm what most would call an annoying woke leftist. And i wondered why it not only made me feel uncomfortable but angry too. I understand that it is because she's pushing me out of my comfort zone. I love her so i defend her but do i like what she's been doing lately ? Instantly, no but i always (well most of the time) grow to enjoy her last input when every has settled down or, more likely, when i finally keep up with her.

That video is like she's going out of her way to not please anyone. Like she's going in the opposite direction of what is expected of her. I'm not sure it is what she would be doing if the reactions were positive, just like with Erotica or Justify My Love she keeps winking and laughing, in this one she at times seems to be wondering what she's doing there, it's a joke. She made herself look like the clown from Tears Of A Clown. The lack of eyebrows does not suit her, i did not even like it 30 years ago. The grillz etc...she's not trying to look pretty, like she makes herself looks scary, monster like...and yet in pure Madonna style (meaning being confusing) she overphotoshops herself to look "pretty". She wants to be challenging and she is. In the end it's not what she does that is interesting but th reaction to it. Mine first, because it makes me ask myself why i have these reactions and what is she triggering in me. I then realize that has much as when i was a little boy and a teenager she pushes "over the borderline" and forces to grow, to be accepting. The reactions from people, even die hard fans is even more interesting. She's not killing anyone, she's not making trumpist statements, she's, on the contrary, being very open and inclusive and it seems like people don't like that and even people who are themselves unconventional. Gays mostly. I see the body shaming, the misogyny, the conservatism etc...i see it everyday in them and not just regarding Madonna. I love she's finally antagonizing them. Well not all of them but that damn "Ikea" fringe of the community. It's ok for a man to do drag, not for a woman. I got it a while ago. Women must either be perfect goddesses or ugly sexless friends. She made herself scary ugly looking and oversexed. She's 64, she shoulf be wearing a princess dress, beautiful and not revealing, and sing ballads about love or a disco song while dresses sexy but not sexual, "classy" like they say, because that's what makes people comfortable, they don't like to be challenged because they don't want to realize their own hypocrisy, while they are asking to be accepted the way they are, they still refuse to accept others the same way too. I've realized we all want the world and others to stay in their lane and the world to be the way we want it to be, meaning like us. 

This last impersonation of Madonna makes me think of Divine. She's pushing the limits of taste and if she's not convincing anyone, because she's so extreme, she's at least exposing how intolerant we are, especially people who like to think they are progressive. I don't care she makes the moral majority and proud conservatives mad or mocking her. It's a given and they probably don't care anymore. Nope, what's interesting lately is how she'exposing progressive people,because she's Madonna, for whatever reasons, what they are willing to accept from someone else or want others to accept from them, they violently refuse it from her, even her fans. And that's what i like about art. For me it was never about how pretty it is but the reaction i have to it and the reaction of others. 

She shakes our molecules. That's how all matters evolve wether it's conscious or unconscious. It's a reaction. 

 

You nailed it.

THANK YOU.

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Can I also say I mostly poking the bear now. I learned from the best. In an earlier post in this thread someone stated that she is still pushing buttons. 

I joked that “yes the self destruct button”

I kinda meant it. 
 

If you look at her “50 questions” video one thing she said when asked what her greatest lesson was was “none of this is real”

Madonna is a control freak. Like … a Freak freak. You think she’d let the general public direct her decline? She’s a student of Bowie . There’s a case to be made that say that her career is now in self managed decline. 
That she refuses to be thrown on the scrap heap so she’s building her own self made heap of scrap to throw herself on. 
 

There’s art and value in this in many ways. 

She’ll still have her former achievement and the money but she seems in a place where she’s either losing it or is actively trying to deconstruct her fame and reputation in the same way she built it up. Live by the sword etc. 

This IS interesting and it’s the kind of art that really would fascinate me because it’s the kind of art you can only really do once you’ve reached the very summit of your career path which she already has. In this case BAD art is a choice that leans into punk principles. The rub comes quick however because this is an Incredibly difficult feat to pull off without some admission along the way that that is  your intention otherwise it does just like you’ve lost your mojo and are just a shit old pop star. 
 

It’s the kind of move I’d have expected from a Madonna of former years but I’m not sure now whether this is just wishful thinking on my part. It also comes at a very odd time in her career. A time where she’s about to make a biopic about her life and is embarking on a mammoth career retrospective. It seems self sabotaging. I suppose  the real question is whether it’s intentional or not?

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1 hour ago, steady75 said:

There’s a case to be made that say that her career is now in self managed decline.

This is interesting. If this is going on it has to be mostly subconscious.

 

1 hour ago, steady75 said:

It also comes at a very odd time in her career. A time where she’s about to make a biopic about her life and is embarking on a mammoth career retrospective. It seems self sabotaging.

I feel that she's felt the need to modernise her old hits as a way of balancing out the pure nostaligia she's embarking on.

She may resent that it's been forced upon her (i.e. that music retrospectives are expected, or beating others to her biopic).

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5 hours ago, Roland Barthes said:

I love how Madonna keeps exposing how conservative people truly are and especially people who think they are not.

It's extremely safe to say that Madonna fans are the least conservative of all the pop fandoms.

The zealouts keep saying that it's the rest of us who are the problem - never Madonna, the untouchable.

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I really hate the last Frozen remixes, and Material Gworrrrlllll, because I hate that kind of music, but they are just a couple of remixes where Madonna have fun. Nothing more. Are you really crucifying Madonna for a couple of remixes and a crazy video? Come on, it's not even a full album with that kind of music.

I really don't understand the meltdowns. 

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20 minutes ago, Aiwa08 said:

I really hate the last Frozen remixes, and Material Gworrrrlllll, because I hate that kind of music, but they are just a couple of remixes where Madonna have fun. Nothing more. Are you really crucifying Madonna for a couple of remixes and a crazy video? Come on, it's not even a full album with that kind of music.

I really don't understand the meltdowns. 

thank you, my feelings as well.
Even if I can stand Frozen on Fire remix, but Material Gworrrrlllll and Hung Up On Tokiwhoever is absolutely not my thing, listened to it once, never no more. Is it wrong thou? Dont think so ... she is not making a big thing out of this, she is clearly aiming at (very) young audience to somehow catch their attention after years, so I am fine with it, at least until she decides to release an album full of this new remixes, then I am gonna be mad. But few digital remixes and youtube videos can be easily ignored. She gave us, longtime fans, FEL recently, so she can make a few songs/remixes for teenagers as well.

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6 hours ago, Drownedboy said:

Another post pretending that this video is modern and progresist and that she is still the groundbreaking queen of all time. 

Ok, she was expected to do amazing job, that´s we expected, knowing her stellar and unique in history carreer. And so far, it´s lazy, underehearsed, ugly, and speedly done, and messy..things Madonna was never linked to. I don´t know if she is having fun. I don´t know if a person who needs to hide her age and do strange things in order to change her face constantly is actually having any fun. i would say she is more terrified than any other thing.

On the one hand, If you need to tell me I´m conservative,  i really don´t give a damn, call me what you will. I think you are in a stage of denial, on the other hand.

Simon Cowell Wow GIF by America's Got Talent

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6 hours ago, Drownedboy said:

Another post pretending that this video is modern and progresist and that she is still the groundbreaking queen of all time. 

Ok, she was expected to do amazing job, that´s we expected, knowing her stellar and unique in history carreer. And so far, it´s lazy, underehearsed, ugly, and speedly done, and messy..things Madonna was never linked to. I don´t know if she is having fun. I don´t know if a person who needs to hide her age and do strange things in order to change her face constantly is actually having any fun. i would say she is more terrified than any other thing.

On the one hand, If you need to tell me I´m conservative,  i really don´t give a damn, call me what you will. I think you are in a stage of denial, on the other hand.

Thank you. I see there's still some smart people in this forum and completely understand what's happening.

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4 hours ago, steady75 said:

sometimes bad art is just bad art and trying to intellectualise it is actually a disservice to art and genuine artistic intent and the value and importance of that. Especially from a former titan and expert of that particular brand of art as a force for change like Madonna. 

The most accurate summary of this entire debate.

4 hours ago, steady75 said:

I do take exception to branding anyone who doesn’t get it or appreciate it or think the same way as conservative. One might brand that as having fascist leanings 

What they’re saying is “if you don’t like the video it means …. about you.” Which is complete rubbish.

Now Madonna fans who don’t like the video must be the same as right wing conservations up in arms about her 80’s and 90’s controversies :lol:  Yes, that makes so much sense.

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10 minutes ago, Drownedboy said:

For me the only really decent song she has released since 2015 would I´ll rise. That is one good song in what almost 8 years? So it´s not a few fun releases between real projects of hq.

I haven't been set on fire by anything since then either really. But its still interesting that the moments we each see as "decent" are still wildy different.That song always makes me think of "Fly Above" by Kandi from RHOA. And calling it a Pride anthem before the community decided it was a Pride anthem was....interesting. 

 

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