Jump to content

Wth is this Rolling Stone piece by Andy Greene claiming 'American Life' as one of the "50 Genuinely Horrible Albums by Brilliant Artists"


mazzona
 Share

Recommended Posts

1 minute ago, Blue Jean said:

They are not a reputable publication anymore. Do they even print physical copies or just online click bait?

I have no idea. The last time I was interested in this rag was the Madonna/Maluma cover. But when I saw the magazine looks like a pamphlet from the early days of the print industry I decided to pass

Link to comment
Share on other sites

25 minutes ago, Blue Jean said:

It was a flop for a mainstream pop artist as big as Madonna. And critically panned.

I don’t really understand why because it’s a great album. As someone else said, it’s better than her last 3 albums. I think a lot of it hung on the lead single which even though I love the song, was not a good choice. I specifically remember the song itself being torn to shreds when it came out. Having said that I also remember Die Another Day also copped a lot of criticism. More so as it was being evaluated as a “bond theme song” and was a bit too left of field for that audience.

Yea, do you remember when it was rumored at the time to have been called Hollywood with that the lead - I get why she changed to AL because of the impending war - but unfortunately yea, when you attack the American institution - you can't win :/

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 minutes ago, Jackie said:

Yea, do you remember when it was rumored at the time to have been called Hollywood with that the lead - I get why she changed to AL because of the impending war - but unfortunately yea, when you attack the American institution - you can't win :/

I do remember that. American Life is a better name. But I think Hollywood would have been a better lead single.

The thing is it was this exact time where literally everybody was starting to believe they could become famous. Regular Joe was flocking to reality tv. So I don't think people really wanted to hear that it wasn't all it was cracked up to be.

I always found it interesting that Lady Gaga launched her career with a pro fame/money theme. It was a complete turnaround from Madonna's message.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Blue Jean said:

I do remember that. American Life is a better name. But I think Hollywood would have been a better lead single.

The thing is it was this exact time where literally everybody was starting to believe they could become famous. Regular Joe was flocking to reality tv. So I don't think people really wanted to hear that it wasn't all it was cracked up to be.

I always found it interesting that Lady Gaga launched her career with a pro fame/money theme. It was a complete turnaround from Madonna's message.

I agree, let alone from someone who made millions from being famous and is now saying, it's all an illusion - I mean, it was great that she wanted to make people think and that's what I love about Madonna, she was willing to risk it all to make a stance, to try and wake people up - 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For heaven's sake.

Not everybody loves Madonna like we do, and not everybody loves AL.
I was disappointed when I listened to the record for the first time. I thought it was boring. RoL and COADF is much more in my taste.

Does that make me a hater? No, it just shows that we all have different taste, and guess what? That's okay. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Fabiolous said:

Madonna wrote most songs by herself on her guitar before meeting with Mirwais. Except for Nothing fails which was written by Joe Henry

Actually Madonna didn't really start to write on her own on guitar until the two musical projects. Demos "the game" and "miss you" are often credited to AL sessions but belong to the first musical project. Most AL tracks are written by M&M, assuming Mirwais wrote chords and M melody but noone knows. X-Static Process is written with Stuart, Easy Ride with Monte. Nothing Fails wasn't written by Joe Henry but by Guy Sigsworth (called "Silly Thing" Madonna's "additional lyrics" are limited to "I've climbed the tree of life" instead of "I've got my standing stone")

Besides that, even if the songs were written by M on guitar, none of her guitar playing is on the record so it makes no sense for the reviewer to comment on it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

For me AL was the final triad of her Veronica Electronica phase. ROL+ Music+AL. They are a great evolution and exploration. The more melodic trance-ic beats from Orbit blend with the more robotic and broken beats of Mirwais, and AL is harsh and raw.

The US at the time were so protective of their identity even having someone like Bush being a puppet. So everything that would feel anti American was dismissed. In Europe the electroclash sound was exploding. Artist like Fisherspooner, Scissor Sisters were making gigs here instead on  the US. Ladytron, FelixDahousecat, Miss Kittin, Vitalic, Green Velvet, Jacques Lucont, Goldfrapp..rough vocals, rough beats, and amalgamation of beats from Detroit, London, Berlin, Paris..

I think they were smart concentrating on these artist to made the mixes and promote the album on this side of the pond.

I was transitioning from living in NY back to London and I was surprised (or not) of how little AL was promoted in the States.

But I was happy of the sound , mixes and all. Apart form the Luc Besson  video  aka shampoo ad, that i never understood.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

People have been hating on Rolling Stone since the 70's, even then many saw it as trash. In 1984 they called her a slut, so I'm not sure why anyone has ever like RS. 

I do think AL is her weakest of the WB years. Yeah even HC is at least fun. 

I think her attitude turned a lot of people off back then, she was endlessly preaching about the illusions of the material world while still fully entrenched in it and enjoying it. Don't tell me it all means nothing while you spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on photo shoots and jet around the world.

Maybe if she had become a Joan Baez type I might have believed her and respected this era more, but it all seemed so shallow.

In terms of the music, it did feel disjointed and not fully realised somehow. Some great lyrics but the production doesn't work for me. 

I will add I like that she did something different and tried different things. I'm glad there are those that love it. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Jackie said:

Yea, do you remember when it was rumored at the time to have been called Hollywood with that the lead - I get why she changed to AL because of the impending war - but unfortunately yea, when you attack the American institution - you can't win :/

I do think Hollywood would have been a better lead single  - it's a better song better video and the remixes were stronger than the ones for American Life and it did not have the rap that got so slated and then the video got pulled and we had that boring flag video for a lead single. I think the lead single being American Life and the timing with the war etc the general public and radio lost interest in subsequent singles and decided the album was not very good as the lead single was not seen as all that good etc.  

It's not my favourite Madonna album but think it's still a great album 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If Hard Candy came out in '03, and AL a bit later, both would be considered among her best.

And I still believe Guy Ritchie talked her out of releasing the AL video. 

I'm fine with people not liking this album, but this is the same magazine that called Justin Timberlake "The King of Pop". They're a little precious over there at the old Stone, God bless em.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, me1981 said:

People have been hating on Rolling Stone since the 70's, even then many saw it as trash. In 1984 they called her a slut, so I'm not sure why anyone has ever like RS. 

I do think AL is her weakest of the WB years. Yeah even HC is at least fun. 

I think her attitude turned a lot of people off back then, she was endlessly preaching about the illusions of the material world while still fully entrenched in it and enjoying it. Don't tell me it all means nothing while you spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on photo shoots and jet around the world.

Maybe if she had become a Joan Baez type I might have believed her and respected this era more, but it all seemed so shallow.

In terms of the music, it did feel disjointed and not fully realised somehow. Some great lyrics but the production doesn't work for me. 

I will add I like that she did something different and tried different things. I'm glad there are those that love it. 

I love the era and the album but I agree that, in retrospective, it was a sign of her life at that time, but after all that has happened later, starting with COADF style and more with Hard Candy, it does not feel honest when you hear it and see the interviews. Sadly the same can be said of the spirituality of ROL, never again seen after 2008. 

And I agree that the promo was disjointed and strange after the second single. The albums better promoted to my eyes, since I follow her were Ray of light and Confessions on a dance floor. Music was not bad but could have been better if she hadn´t been pregnant, if it had been a fourth single with clip and if What if feels like for a girld would have been the same version the single and the videoclip.

American life disaster of second part of the promotion, Hard candy disaster after the first single, MDNA disaster after the Superbowl, Rebel Heart disaster with the leak demos, and Ghostown and Bitch I´m madonna coming at the same time and all for almost nothing, and Madame x with 5 singles being out at the same time? At least, with these two last albums, she worked hard on the tv interviews. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I still dream of the "Hollywood" universe, where she cleared the rights with the boudain estate and the video wasn't taken out of rotation. That as a first track segueing into nobody knows me, followed by intervention would be my dream opening. The second part of the promotion was indeed horrible. It started with remixed and revisited and the stupid gap commercial. It was said by Caresse Henry at the time that the return to Blonde hair was a deliberate descision to remind people of the Madonna they know, guess that's also why the video for LP was so meh. Still it's funny there hasn't been any later praise for the album if you think it was written before the huge impact that social media has on our lives and it is really about that if you think about it.

Also someone mentioned that it was universally panned but that really isn't the case, most media outlets gave it a positive, though not glowing review. Don't underestimate the huge negative impact of the so called "anti america" sentiment, here in Europe we were more on her page, even though on the album itself there is little to no anti america statement, hell the title track isn't even really about america but about capitalism. As for why she pulled the video, didn't she say herself that she got threats to her children and that that was where she drew the line?

Anyway, I totally understand the record isn't for everyone, but for me it was the last time she was ahead of the curve, MX was a sort of return to form 15 years later

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The "American Life" video fiasco is what harmed the album (and her career in the long term). Without all that drama I don't think the reception would have been that, that terrible.

Musically the album was the logical next step after "Ray Of Light" and "Music", it's like the ending of that trilogy. And "American Life", the song, is not miles away (ahem) from "Die Another Day", her previous US Top 10 single, only a few months earlier (another hit for her yet in the middle of all the bad "Swept Away" press). After the "Music" album campaign and "Die Another Day" smashing, surely Warner and herself felt confident about the album.

But the original "AL" video... while a great artistic piece, the timing and release couldn't have been worse. It just wasn't right. They hyped the video for weeks and it was a little bit weird, like them "using" the war. And when it was released in Europe for a day and then pulled it was a mess.

I truly believe her when she said it was a pro-peace message, but at the same time it all was a miscalculation of epic proportions. It was hard to believe that the woman with the sharpest marketing sense in the music business would make THAT mistake.

I love "American Life", single and album, with all my heart, one of my faves actually. But what a time to be a Madonna fan. 2003 was A LOT.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Prayer said:

The "American Life" video fiasco is what harmed the album (and her career in the long term). Without all that drama I don't think the reception would have been that, that terrible.

Musically the album was the logical next step after "Ray Of Light" and "Music", it's like the ending of that trilogy. And "American Life", the song, is not miles away (ahem) from "Die Another Day", her previous US Top 10 single, only a few months earlier (another hit for her yet in the middle of all the bad "Swept Away" press). After the "Music" album campaign and "Die Another Day" smashing, surely Warner and herself felt confident about the album.

But the original "AL" video... while a great artistic piece, the timing and release couldn't have been worse. It just wasn't right. They hyped the video for weeks and it was a little bit weird, like them "using" the war. And when it was released in Europe for a day and then pulled it was a mess.

I truly believe her when she said it was a pro-peace message, but at the same time it all was a miscalculation of epic proportions. It was hard to believe that the woman with the sharpest marketing sense in the music business would make THAT mistake.

The message of the video was right on point. America just did not want to hear it. And she pulled the video anyway which saved her from a huge backlash for sure. Perhaps it was the right thing to do for her career or safety but the statement itself was on the right side of history. What happened there is not a lot different to Putin invading Ukraine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Prayer said:

The "American Life" video fiasco is what harmed the album (and her career in the long term). Without all that drama I don't think the reception would have been that, that terrible.

Musically the album was the logical next step after "Ray Of Light" and "Music", it's like the ending of that trilogy. And "American Life", the song, is not miles away (ahem) from "Die Another Day", her previous US Top 10 single, only a few months earlier (another hit for her yet in the middle of all the bad "Swept Away" press). After the "Music" album campaign and "Die Another Day" smashing, surely Warner and herself felt confident about the album.

But the original "AL" video... while a great artistic piece, the timing and release couldn't have been worse. It just wasn't right. They hyped the video for weeks and it was a little bit weird, like them "using" the war. And when it was released in Europe for a day and then pulled it was a mess.

I truly believe her when she said it was a pro-peace message, but at the same time it all was a miscalculation of epic proportions. It was hard to believe that the woman with the sharpest marketing sense in the music business would make THAT mistake.

I love "American Life", single and album, with all my heart, one of my faves actually. But what a time to be a Madonna fan. 2003 was A LOT.

What confuses me a little is that she performed the song live on the Reinvention Tour in a way that remained true to the original video’s interpretation of the song. 
Was it that by then the political climate had changed? Or did she feel a tour is a better medium to relay her message?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Blue Jean said:

The message of the video was right on point. America just did not want to hear it. And she pulled the video anyway which saved her from a huge backlash for sure. Perhaps it was the right thing to do for her career or safety but the statement itself was on the right side of history. What happened there is not a lot different to Putin invading Ukraine.

Yes. Artistically and as a statement it was and still is a triumph. But it was also a commercial suicide and a PR disaster, both the video and the pulling out. She never fully recovered from that in the US.

Of course Europe received it much better and the album and both the "American Life" and "Hollywood" singles single did quite well here.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Miki said:

What confuses me a little is that she performed the song live on the Reinvention Tour in a way that remained true to the original video’s interpretation of the song. 
Was it that by then the political climate had changed? Or did she feel a tour is a better medium to relay her message?

Both. By Spring 2004 it was clear for a lot of people in the US the war had not been a great idea in the end. Plus, on her tour she's always more free to express whatever she wants. It's not the same a video on heavy rotation on MTV than a theatrical show.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Write here...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Terms of Use