Very honestly, has Taylor Swift surpassed Madonna all-around?

[FrozenRain 364]

She does play the game very well that Taylor, I give her that

[Aiwa08 18,460]

1 hour ago, lucasciccone said:

No one can deny her commercial success, which is HUGE, but IMO she will never have Madonna's cultural impact. That's what makes you a legend.

Exactly. When I was young, Madonna was everywhere. Her music was unavoidable, whether you liked it or not (the same was true for artists like Michael Jackson, Tina Turner, etc, etc, etc). I know who Taylor Swift is, but I only know her by name—I’m not familiar with her music or videos because they don’t interest me. So, in my view, her cultural impact is nowhere near that of Madonna

[Tudors 676]

This feels like an atrl thread

[Enrico 16,090]

It's funny cause the press is  pumping her all over and talking about her almost everywhere, but nobody who is over 25 can name or sing any of her songs.

She may win a lot of now useless VMAS awards (is Mtv still a thing?), she may have million of streams, but she has very little impact on music and culture.

I think the thing that reminds me most of Madonna's success is all those girls trying to dress like her. I was in London in August and the trains were full of this new generation of "wannabes".  Still, dressing as Madonna was almost a rebel move, this look is just superficial, glittery and conformist.

[pawn_shop_blues 729]

yes and no. she's famous and everyone talks about her but she is not madonna.

[Piksel8 727]

1 hour ago, androiduser said:

well, I meant to say that Taylor set the new standards and I don't see any of her peers breaking her records, it will probably be some pop star from one of the next few generations. It took a long for someone like Taylor to achieve all that.

I'm pretty Beyonce was the one to beat her in touring. She technically did surpass Madonna's Sticky and Sweet first. Bey just got lazy and ended her tour after 56 stops. Records by artists right now doesn't set any legacy standards since one record can be beaten in a few years. Its the same with movies. Madonna held a lot of her records for decades.

[Scottyx 9,258]

3 hours ago, adled said:

honestly, does anything knows any of her songs besides Shake it off ? nope .

so I wouldn't worry, Madonna is safe from that insignificant crap .

I do not even know that one. I only listen to Mariah's Shake It Off.

[Tudors 676]

Sabrina already ended that old hag grandma Swift

 

[scamper 2,039]

This is how I see this:

First of all, Madonna was famous all over the world and her songs where everywhere. Here is Spain, for example,  we know who is Taylor Swift but I don't see people singing her songs, buying her albums or dressing like her. It's like if she's admired for the success she has in the USA more than for her inpact in our country. Of course she made her shows here and was like "Wow, it's incredible how much people went to her concerts". She made 2 60.000 people concerts (120.000) that is great but the same two nights ACDC made two concerts with 70.000 people each night (140.000) and the news said nothing about it. It was like "We have to talk just about her". There are other artists here that get her success or even more but you only hear about what Taylor Swift does. All her "records" and all those things but you never hear her on radio stations or in a supermarket or in a car that goes near your house listening music very loud.

When I was young Madonna (and her work) was everywhere. And I remember even my grandmother knew who was Madonna (that bad influence for our kids). 

I think Taylor has a great career, but is just because she's a good influence for people and they try to sell her as much as they can. Everything is so perfect around her... It's like living in Disneyworld. I think Taylor will have a problem if someday she makes a "mistake" and does something not bad, just a little incorrect... I think people won't forgive her. Madonna, on the other side was always the bad influence. She made what she wanted to make and that was a problem for a lot of people and that's why sometimes they don't recognize her talent. But that is what make her (and her inpact in sociery) so big. Madonna is the only artist that after something like "Sex" could still be there after 30 years (look what happened with Janet and her nipple, people don't forgive the good girls).

I think it's impossible to compare them because they are from different times and music industry is very different but I have one thing clear. What makes them different is that Madonna always have had people that love her and lots of people that hated her (and they help to keep her there, like it or not). Maybe Taylor has more people that loves her now but there's a lot of people that only feels indiference for her... And love always ends but hate...

 

[Inco 11,097]

Taylor who?

[A. A. Aardvark 5,102]

verb

past tense: surpassed; past participle: surpassed

exceed; be greater than.

"pre-war levels of production were surpassed in 1989"


only if your someone who thinks
Female Pop Star X is in direct competition with Female Pop Star Y 
IF 
I never hear her name again = it'll be too soon

[A. A. Aardvark 5,102]

20 minutes ago, Tudors said:

Sabrina already ended that old hag Swift

ageist 
and 
sexist 

fascists 
judge by appearance 

[MPowered 7,768]

Don't you think it’s quite audacious to come to a Madonna forum OF ALL PLACES to ask such a dumb question along with an essay that no one has the time or the energy to read?

This is quite obviously an attempt to instigate drama and to trigger Madonna fans.

I personally am beyond sick and tired of having to hear and read about Hitlor Swift. This forum is the only place on the internet that hasn’t been entirely infested with her inorganic omnipresence. I pray to witness the day where she fades into oblivion along with her rabid army of plain Jane fans.

[Tudors 676]

11 minutes ago, MPowered said:

Don't you think it’s quite audacious to come to a Madonna forum OF ALL PLACES to ask such a dumb question along with an essay that no one has the time or the energy to read?

This is quite obviously an attempt to instigate drama and to trigger Madonna fans.

I personally am beyond sick and tired of having to hear and read about Hitlor Swift. This forum is the only place on the internet that hasn’t been entirely infested with her inorganic omnipresence. I pray to witness the day where she fades into oblivion along with her rabid army of plain Jane fans.

Well I'm sure she wishes she could hide this Pic forever. She probably thought he was so cute

[Blue Skies 1,633]

3 hours ago, Arckangel said:

Even when Madonna was younger than Taylor Swift, she was not winning as many awards. Taylor Swift just rakes everything in year after year after year. Does this mean that things are overhyped these days? Or maybe the industry sees Taylor Swift as that brilliantly talented. Or maybe Taylor has the bestest connections!

Shes more loved by the music industry and that translates to the sports and other industries as well 

 

When M was Taylor’s age she was dating Rodman easily the most eccentric basketball player in the league at the time.  To the NFL her and T Kelce are a match in heaven 

[JustinTimes 978]

Music is consumed differently these days, back then you had to travel around to record shops to find stuff, and playing records and cassettes repeatedly didn't add more sales. Now all Taylor Swift fans have to do is stream her rubbish repeatedly on their phones in bed and that contributes to "sales"  so of course it looks like she's more successful than she really is. She's a mediocre, forgettable nobody that silly little girls think is cool. I can't stand her. I wish people would stop going on about her, she's boring as fuck.

[Ian 2,453]

insta-perma-ban

[PHIL 295]

in total, no, not yet.

taylor is major right now, just like M in the late 80s / early 90s and for the young generation she's everything.

maybe she's the more successful singer by numbers soon.

has she surpassed M with cultural significance?
i'd say: no way!

madonna's legacy is so much more than being number 1 and having this friendship like relationship with her fans. 

[Alibaba 1,561]

Taylor Swift seems to be much more of a controlled construct as an industry player than Madonna ever was. As already stated, her music doesn’t reach across cultural divisions the way Madonna’s did. Madonna was a truly global powerhouse…Taylor Swift’s touring success is really more a reflection of today’s YOLO/FOMO consumerism on steroids. Attending the Eras Tour was the thing to do, and people do what everyone else is doing. Yes, it’s always been the case that corporatism dictates group think, but it’s far more palpable now than ever before. Madonna was antithetical to this, even if she was bankable. She was always an underdog, even at her commercial peak, and this was part of her appeal. Her exploration of different musical genres makes her discography particularly unique, and it’s Madonna’s ability to successfully lend her voice to almost any genre that  many young people today are in awe of when they discover her music. 
In Swift’s case, while there have been discernible shifts in the production of her albums over the course of her career, they aren’t innovative; they are adapted to sound current. Like Lana Del Rey, her musical style is quite consistent. In total honesty, I personally find this boring. When an artist stays faithful to the same songwriting style and delivery, I lose interest. I loved Del Rey through Ultraviolence, but it became an exercise in patience to endure her output thereafter. That isn’t to say she hasn’t made some great tracks since 2014, but the vibe never changes. I feel the same about Swift, except that I find her music extraordinarily tedious. Lyrically, she is confessional but lacks the poetry of Joni Mitchell to elevate the songs above a perpetual adolescent perspective on life, which is, I guess, why her music seems to appeal to children. At almost 35, she seems preternaturally stunted. I suppose one might say that Madonna was no beacon of maturity at 35 either, but her subversiveness combined with an implicit intellect gave depth to her work.
The media may elevate her as a cultural phenomenon, and clearly she is that to many. However, I think she peaked as a pop star with 1989. Midnights was like a comeback in my eyes, and so it’s hard to say what the future holds for her. Perhaps she will try other styles, but like Beyonce (Gaga doesn’t qualify at all at this stage as her influential cultural peak ended a decade ago), I think any effort to compare her to Madonna is pointless. Madonna has really managed to remain culturally, artistically and commercially influential for longer than anyone else. When Taylor has been in the game for over 40 years we can reassess. Until then, I think the most obvious conclusion lies in the notion that Swift has more VMAs than Madonna, and yet I can only recall seeing two of her videos in all these years. That explains it all in a nutshell. 

[Voguerista 13,267]

I think Taylor and her success is phenomenal and at a legendary level now. Time will tell if she can be as successful and legendary as Madonna but she sure seems to have made her mark now and has my complete respect. 
 

[Prayer 16,706]

@Alibaba just nailed it.

 Taylor's impact since she got not big, but legendary BIG (around the mid-late 10s) and after all her dramas with Spotify (seems like ages ago but it was only 2017 she didn't want to do anything with them - until she got her cash of course), the Taylor's versions... all is always about the money she generates. Read any piece about her impact in the last five years or about the recent tour. It's all money talk. The tickets she sells, the boost in the economy for the cities she plays live, etc. etc.

Occasionally it translates into "power": the highest amount of VMAs, the full Billboard Hot 100 Top 10, things like that.

But it's never or rarely about the music.

Money is the anthem of success, yes, but it's also quite telling what most of this is about.

She's one of the superstars of this generation and that's obvious and undeniable. And the girl can write a pop song.

But the only comparison to Madonna is that they both are excellent marketers.

[Alpha 1,938]

Damn so many out of touch people, it doesn't surprise me. Ive said for years that madonna fans are no longer connected to the zeitgeist and the zeitgeist has no interest in madonna. If you can't name a song other than Shake it Off you're either too old or have been living under a rock. It's giving me "madonna sucks now despite me not listening to any of her albums since Immaculate Collection". I've never owned a Taylor album but I'd be pretty stupid to say I only know Shake it Off. What's next, Lady Gaga is a one hit wonder with Poker Face? Britney only had Oops I Did It Again?

[scamper 2,039]

2 minutes ago, Alpha said:

Damn so many out of touch people, it doesn't surprise me. Ive said for years that madonna fans are no longer connected to the zeitgeist and the zeitgeist has no interest in madonna. If you can't name a song other than Shake it Off you're either too old or have been living under a rock. It's giving me "madonna sucks now despite me not listening to any of her albums since Immaculate Collection". I've never owned a Taylor album but I'd be pretty stupid to say I only know Shake it Off. What's next, Lady Gaga is a one hit wonder with Poker Face? Britney only had Oops I Did It Again?

Well, as I said, I guess it depends of where you live but at least where I live I've never listened her on the radio (apart of shake it off) and I talk at work with people in her 20's and for them Taylor is like Madonna... A woman with success but they don't know one single song from them. In fact from Taylor they just know "Shake it up" and from Madonna just "Material girl". But ask them about Shakira (for saying one) and all of them think she sells more than Madonna in the 80's or Taylor now.

Maybe where you live they are all day playing Taylor everywhere... That's why is very difficult to know the truth. As @prayer said before here all they talk is about the money she makes and the admiration is for how she gets the money, not for her work. About what you say about Lady Gaga or Britney... I've listened to them everywhere at the time they start to get famous and they still play them on the radios something that I can't say about Taylor (and as I said, I'm talking about the reallity where I live. Maybe in the rest of the world is completly different).

[A. A. Aardvark 5,102]

IF I HEAR HER FUCKING NAME ONCE MORE

Do you remember the guy who complained about Radio 1 playing 'Dear Jessie' 18 times one day to Points Of View ?
 

[Alpha 1,938]

19 minutes ago, scamper said:

Well, as I said, I guess it depends of where you live but at least where I live I've never listened her on the radio (apart of shake it off) and I talk at work with people in her 20's and for them Taylor is like Madonna... A woman with success but they don't know one single song from them. In fact from Taylor they just know "Shake it up" and from Madonna just "Material girl". But ask them about Shakira (for saying one) and all of them think she sells more than Madonna in the 80's or Taylor now.

Maybe where you live they are all day playing Taylor everywhere... That's why is very difficult to know the truth. As @prayer said before here all they talk is about the money she makes and the admiration is for how she gets the money, not for her work. About what you say about Lady Gaga or Britney... I've listened to them everywhere at the time they start to get famous and they still play them on the radios something that I can't say about Taylor (and as I said, I'm talking about the reallity where I live. Maybe in the rest of the world is completly different).

So then they live under a rock. Lol i can definitely tell you I don't think I've ever hated the word "karma" as much as i do now! So i definitely stand by what I say. Either old or living under a rock or hate taylor that much they'll lie and say they don't know her music.