robder

Clearly you didn’t watch the comment since the basis of your comment are very ignorant and misinformed.
It wasn’t a joke or part of a comedic routine. It was made as a serious statement.
It’s not like a comedian making a gay joke but seriously taking an anti-gay stance.
And yes everyone is entitled to their opinions. But public personas have to be responsible about the messages they put out there. Since they’re opinion makers. 
I assume Madonna fans should be aware of this by now
 

Very sorry for any pain your lived experiences have given you, but also,
 
Blaire White is a also bad example here. She is a known conservative whose whole channel is basically there to posit herself as a "good, acceptable trans person" compared to people who don't have her looks and privilege. I can spend my time finding voices of many, many trans people who've been hurt by this, but what you've posted is basically the "I have black friends, I can't be racist" defense. Or specifically, "This trans person says this is not transphobic, so it's not". 
Watch this hilarious yet very real takedown of Blaire White, maybe you'll understand my point of view a bit clearer.
 

Also, since I see that the benchmark for comedy is awfully low these days, please check out this show! It's called "Crazy Ex-Girlfriend", it's a hilarious way of dealing with mental illness and romantic clichés, and shows people of all ages, appearances, orientations living normal, vivid lives. Oh, and they've written over 150 original songs to feature in each episode, each one with a music video as well! Here's a brilliant example. You can find all four season on Netflix, so stream that instead of Chappelle.
 
 

Sorry to be replying to you again, but what he said wasn't even a joke. Please inform yourself. He said, quote, "I'm team TERF" and voiced support for homophobic black men. How is this funny or comedic in any way?

I don't see a wider conversation about cancel culture though.
I see the trans community + allies critiquing a viewpoint.
The distraction technique of the alt-right is and always has been to cry 'cancel culture'.
Many of these influencer types are behaving like absolute melts, unable to engage in any kind of reasoned discourse. "Thin skin" being one such example.

No, you missed the point completely by presenting this as "Poor little Chappelle vs The World". He's literally going to be fine. To him, this is merely a slap on the wrist, while you present this as, let's see, 
[QUOTE]
[...]completely cancelled[...]
[...]silenced[...]
Are people with different views, different understandings, different lives supposed to not have careers, friends and a public life?
[/QUOTE]
which is not happening, and is merely a strawman i.e. a complete misrepresentation of the situation, on top of the people who actually got fired by Netflix. I'm not saying that this can't be wielded against regular people, which is a completely separate and valid issue, but Chappelle? Give me a break. You cannot be silenced while simultaneously having a two hour special on the biggest platform on the planet. Think about it for a second, please. No one's gonna murder him for being Chappelle, but people definitely get murdered for being trans.
 
Also, the author of this thread also creates a strawman by bringing Madonna in this topic just to rile people up with fictional scenarios, and they simply wanted to air their support for transphobic actions proudly. The end.

I'm sick of us giving the benefit of the doubt to people who say harmful things, like you just did, @PaperFaces. What about the people who simply don't say stupid shit ever, and just want to live their lives in peace? Who gives them a gold star and lists everything good they've ever done when they make a mistake? Chappelle is going to be fine, he's got his money, his family, his lawyers, literally nothing will happen to him. Who will be accountable when they find yet another trans person murdered? Definitely not Chappelle, even though his actions pushed that trigger a micrometer more. They're an easy target for all of these terrible out-of-touch celebrities because they're almost powerless. The Netflix employees who walked out got fired. Why was their "express yourself" stance shut down brutally, while Chappelle walks away with 23 million dollars? Are you okay?
In just one of the multitude of ways he was wrong, he posits this debate as "white LGBTs" vs. "uneducated ignorant blacks", as if DaBaby isn't also a millionaire, and as if a person can't be simultaneously black and trans, making them poorer than both marginalized groups. This is called intersectionality, which he clearly knows nothing about, since he hasn't been a regular normal human being in decades. The same is true for Madonna, and it shows on occasion (let's all suppress the memory of the witch doctor whose opinions she shared on her platform with millions of followers). Celebrities need to shut up on things they know nothing about, and should uplift the voiceless. Not attack the weakest parts of society, which are already targets without their involvement. You can't use your oppression to oppress others, that's not how it works.
As for Madonna, I hope she will say something trans-supportive, no context needed. She doesn't need to cut Chappelle, she didn't do anything wrong.
I do agree that saying "Chappelle said something transphobic" and "Chappelle is a transphobe" are... sort of two different things? The other is generalization. The first can be apologized for, amended, learned from. The second is often a place where you can't return from, and I still hope this isn't yet another lost soul on the path of evil and bigotry. If he has a history of transphobia, I'm sorry for, ironically, giving him the benefit of the doubt as well. There's no excusing for what he did, just hope that he's not going to go Graham Linehan on us from now on.

Chapelle's speech should be cut because it was long and boring as hell. Bitch butchered God Control for this? The Polaroid auction and Chapelle segment shouldnt have been included, regardless of what Chepell said or did. 

If he had joked around "gay men aren't real men", I don't think this thread would exist.

Great question....and there are no shoulds.
...but this is a community that needs allies.
Plus the exclusionary conversations around trans people (privileged people discussing what rights you should have in the next room etc) mirror the 90s era of homophobia almost exactly.
DC shouldn't be cancelled - indeed, he hasn't and will probably never be cancelled. Neither have trans people got 'thin skin' as he puts it. The trans narrative is one of survival...you have to be pretty hardcore to deal with that! He does however need to be publicly challenged (and repeatedly).
There's nothing more annoying than successful people with HUGE fan bases and 100,000's of followers on social media complaining about being cancelled (JK Rowling for one).
It's also lazy "comedy" because he's not talking about lived experience. This is a great youtube on the subject (just replace Ricky Gervais with David Chapelle): 
Madonna may be a trans ally and staunch supporter of gay and women's rights but she's been fairly quiet around trans politics.
I'd love to hear her speak up - whilst allowing Dave Chapelle to fail. Dialogue is important after all!...and he's got it very wrong on this occasion. 
 

I agree with most points here...other than "I don't think David Chapelle is transphobic." 
I get what's meant by this, but it's important to deconstruct what transphobia means, along with the forms it can present in.
It doesn't necessarily need to mean direct anger/abuse/insults...
Transphobia is fear of the trans agenda and what it represents. Indirect transphobia includes spouting comments that cause harm, even without the express/surface intent to do so.
I've experienced indirect homophobia millions of times in the form of tiny micro-aggressions. An example could be, "I LOVE the gays but i don't think they should be able to marry in churches simply because religion states that this kind of union should be between man and woman." (etc yawn).
David Chapelle is transphobic. But this doesn't necessarily mean he needs to be a social pariah - it just means he needs challenging; publicly, loudly and repeatedly.

I agree with most points here...other than "I don't think David Chapelle is transphobic." 
I get what's meant by this, but it's important to deconstruct what transphobia means, along with the forms it can present in.
It doesn't necessarily need to mean direct anger/abuse/insults...
Transphobia is fear of the trans agenda and what it represents. Indirect transphobia includes spouting comments that cause harm, even without the express/surface intent to do so.
I've experienced indirect homophobia millions of times in the form of tiny micro-aggressions. An example could be, "I LOVE the gays but i don't think they should be able to marry in churches simply because religion states that this kind of union should be between man and woman." (etc yawn).
David Chapelle is transphobic. But this doesn't necessarily mean he needs to be a social pariah - it just means he needs challenging; publicly, loudly and repeatedly.

Great question....and there are no shoulds.
...but this is a community that needs allies.
Plus the exclusionary conversations around trans people (privileged people discussing what rights you should have in the next room etc) mirror the 90s era of homophobia almost exactly.
DC shouldn't be cancelled - indeed, he hasn't and will probably never be cancelled. Neither have trans people got 'thin skin' as he puts it. The trans narrative is one of survival...you have to be pretty hardcore to deal with that! He does however need to be publicly challenged (and repeatedly).
There's nothing more annoying than successful people with HUGE fan bases and 100,000's of followers on social media complaining about being cancelled (JK Rowling for one).
It's also lazy "comedy" because he's not talking about lived experience. This is a great youtube on the subject (just replace Ricky Gervais with David Chapelle): 
Madonna may be a trans ally and staunch supporter of gay and women's rights but she's been fairly quiet around trans politics.
I'd love to hear her speak up - whilst allowing Dave Chapelle to fail. Dialogue is important after all!...and he's got it very wrong on this occasion. 
 

Great question....and there are no shoulds.
...but this is a community that needs allies.
Plus the exclusionary conversations around trans people (privileged people discussing what rights you should have in the next room etc) mirror the 90s era of homophobia almost exactly.
DC shouldn't be cancelled - indeed, he hasn't and will probably never be cancelled. Neither have trans people got 'thin skin' as he puts it. The trans narrative is one of survival...you have to be pretty hardcore to deal with that! He does however need to be publicly challenged (and repeatedly).
There's nothing more annoying than successful people with HUGE fan bases and 100,000's of followers on social media complaining about being cancelled (JK Rowling for one).
It's also lazy "comedy" because he's not talking about lived experience. This is a great youtube on the subject (just replace Ricky Gervais with David Chapelle): 
Madonna may be a trans ally and staunch supporter of gay and women's rights but she's been fairly quiet around trans politics.
I'd love to hear her speak up - whilst allowing Dave Chapelle to fail. Dialogue is important after all!...and he's got it very wrong on this occasion. 
 

Great question....and there are no shoulds.
...but this is a community that needs allies.
Plus the exclusionary conversations around trans people (privileged people discussing what rights you should have in the next room etc) mirror the 90s era of homophobia almost exactly.
DC shouldn't be cancelled - indeed, he hasn't and will probably never be cancelled. Neither have trans people got 'thin skin' as he puts it. The trans narrative is one of survival...you have to be pretty hardcore to deal with that! He does however need to be publicly challenged (and repeatedly).
There's nothing more annoying than successful people with HUGE fan bases and 100,000's of followers on social media complaining about being cancelled (JK Rowling for one).
It's also lazy "comedy" because he's not talking about lived experience. This is a great youtube on the subject (just replace Ricky Gervais with David Chapelle): 
Madonna may be a trans ally and staunch supporter of gay and women's rights but she's been fairly quiet around trans politics.
I'd love to hear her speak up - whilst allowing Dave Chapelle to fail. Dialogue is important after all!...and he's got it very wrong on this occasion. 
 

Great question....and there are no shoulds.
...but this is a community that needs allies.
Plus the exclusionary conversations around trans people (privileged people discussing what rights you should have in the next room etc) mirror the 90s era of homophobia almost exactly.
DC shouldn't be cancelled - indeed, he hasn't and will probably never be cancelled. Neither have trans people got 'thin skin' as he puts it. The trans narrative is one of survival...you have to be pretty hardcore to deal with that! He does however need to be publicly challenged (and repeatedly).
There's nothing more annoying than successful people with HUGE fan bases and 100,000's of followers on social media complaining about being cancelled (JK Rowling for one).
It's also lazy "comedy" because he's not talking about lived experience. This is a great youtube on the subject (just replace Ricky Gervais with David Chapelle): 
Madonna may be a trans ally and staunch supporter of gay and women's rights but she's been fairly quiet around trans politics.
I'd love to hear her speak up - whilst allowing Dave Chapelle to fail. Dialogue is important after all!...and he's got it very wrong on this occasion. 
 

Chappelle is a transphobic asshole and so is anyone who supports and defends him. Now if you can't live with being called transphobic then don't be. As for Madonna she should have included Lil Nas X instead of Chappelle whom no one cares about outside of the US and his coming out as terf is not his first nasty comment about the lgbt community. So if Madonna gets in hot water for standing by this moron it will be deserved because it makes her look like a hypocrite. She benefited from the trans community with Vogue so she should at least support them when they are attacked not only by this sack of shit but also by a huge company like Netflix whom after boring everyone with their series by (most ofthe time) ridiculously including every possible minority in the cast to boost their streaming ratings are now showing its true face.

It’s not my favorite concert of hers. And while there’s improvements in sound, picture and color quality, I’m still craving for a straight-forward concert film.

I gave it a 5/10

Please excuse my censorship, the word hasn't been used in a formal discussion since April and as a gay guy, haven't encountered one in decades!
 

I can't believe I only just got around to seeing it!
It's a 6.5 out of 10 from me.
I liked it! It's a grower - got MUCH better as it went on. Huge disappointment at first.
I watched Bjork at the Albert Hall this week and the simplicity of it made me feel like I'd been to an intimate gig. It allowed me to focus on the subtleties of the performance. There's something about all the overlays/effects of Madame X that make me feel like I'm millions of miles away from the show. Constant prescribed camera angles take away any kind of agency in how you want to view things. I felt like one of those poor foie gras ducks.

Also - I normally get annoyed with her documentary segments but this needed it because there was SO much to talk about. No backstage footage??! So we never hear about her early curfews, injury problems and Covid shutdown. Massive missed opportunity imo.
Negatives:That pirate panto costume and the fact that she comes out autotuned (unforgivable - even if it is a stylistic choice).I found God Control completely unwatchable due to the edit (my eyes actually hurt) and Dark Ballet was just plain weird (not in a good way). Sometimes she appears to be lip syncing the autotune which made me feel ridiculously far away from the experience. The footage is often from a different night than the vocal you're actually hearing. Thankfully this improves after the opener.

Positives:Human nature was beautiful - I'd love to have seen it. The muted jazz trumpet works beautifully and the shadow puppets are ace. She manages to look gorgeous and the spoken word segments, whilst clumsily patchworked from loads of nights (losing intimacy), are quite funny. Batuka vocoder creates distance ruining the community feel of the song. Killers who are partying is my fave of the night - and of the film (and the album). The simplicity is great and I love the composition. Crazy vocals sound nice and it's nice to be reminded of the brilliance of Medellin (such at atmospheric number). The laboured breathing during the Rescue Me part takes on a new meaning with Covid (!). Come Alive looks incredible on the screen but the vocals are held back and anything but live. I love the version of future and the finale works well - I forgot how beautiful that Versace dress was!

She nailed it in places and I'm pleased the warmth of the Fado bit translated to the screen.

My two penneth!

I can't believe I only just got around to seeing it!
It's a 6.5 out of 10 from me.
I liked it! It's a grower - got MUCH better as it went on. Huge disappointment at first.
I watched Bjork at the Albert Hall this week and the simplicity of it made me feel like I'd been to an intimate gig. It allowed me to focus on the subtleties of the performance. There's something about all the overlays/effects of Madame X that make me feel like I'm millions of miles away from the show. Constant prescribed camera angles take away any kind of agency in how you want to view things. I felt like one of those poor foie gras ducks.

Also - I normally get annoyed with her documentary segments but this needed it because there was SO much to talk about. No backstage footage??! So we never hear about her early curfews, injury problems and Covid shutdown. Massive missed opportunity imo.
Negatives:That pirate panto costume and the fact that she comes out autotuned (unforgivable - even if it is a stylistic choice).I found God Control completely unwatchable due to the edit (my eyes actually hurt) and Dark Ballet was just plain weird (not in a good way). Sometimes she appears to be lip syncing the autotune which made me feel ridiculously far away from the experience. The footage is often from a different night than the vocal you're actually hearing. Thankfully this improves after the opener.

Positives:Human nature was beautiful - I'd love to have seen it. The muted jazz trumpet works beautifully and the shadow puppets are ace. She manages to look gorgeous and the spoken word segments, whilst clumsily patchworked from loads of nights (losing intimacy), are quite funny. Batuka vocoder creates distance ruining the community feel of the song. Killers who are partying is my fave of the night - and of the film (and the album). The simplicity is great and I love the composition. Crazy vocals sound nice and it's nice to be reminded of the brilliance of Medellin (such at atmospheric number). The laboured breathing during the Rescue Me part takes on a new meaning with Covid (!). Come Alive looks incredible on the screen but the vocals are held back and anything but live. I love the version of future and the finale works well - I forgot how beautiful that Versace dress was!

She nailed it in places and I'm pleased the warmth of the Fado bit translated to the screen.

My two penneth!

I can't believe I only just got around to seeing it!
It's a 6.5 out of 10 from me.
I liked it! It's a grower - got MUCH better as it went on. Huge disappointment at first.
I watched Bjork at the Albert Hall this week and the simplicity of it made me feel like I'd been to an intimate gig. It allowed me to focus on the subtleties of the performance. There's something about all the overlays/effects of Madame X that make me feel like I'm millions of miles away from the show. Constant prescribed camera angles take away any kind of agency in how you want to view things. I felt like one of those poor foie gras ducks.

Also - I normally get annoyed with her documentary segments but this needed it because there was SO much to talk about. No backstage footage??! So we never hear about her early curfews, injury problems and Covid shutdown. Massive missed opportunity imo.
Negatives:That pirate panto costume and the fact that she comes out autotuned (unforgivable - even if it is a stylistic choice).I found God Control completely unwatchable due to the edit (my eyes actually hurt) and Dark Ballet was just plain weird (not in a good way). Sometimes she appears to be lip syncing the autotune which made me feel ridiculously far away from the experience. The footage is often from a different night than the vocal you're actually hearing. Thankfully this improves after the opener.

Positives:Human nature was beautiful - I'd love to have seen it. The muted jazz trumpet works beautifully and the shadow puppets are ace. She manages to look gorgeous and the spoken word segments, whilst clumsily patchworked from loads of nights (losing intimacy), are quite funny. Batuka vocoder creates distance ruining the community feel of the song. Killers who are partying is my fave of the night - and of the film (and the album). The simplicity is great and I love the composition. Crazy vocals sound nice and it's nice to be reminded of the brilliance of Medellin (such at atmospheric number). The laboured breathing during the Rescue Me part takes on a new meaning with Covid (!). Come Alive looks incredible on the screen but the vocals are held back and anything but live. I love the version of future and the finale works well - I forgot how beautiful that Versace dress was!

She nailed it in places and I'm pleased the warmth of the Fado bit translated to the screen.

My two penneth!

It was annoying but this debate pales into insignificance when put next to Rebel Heart which is completely unwatchable and cringeworthy.
She really showed a human side on Rebel Heart and it was really accessible to watch live. The DVD however just looks horribly sanitised and over processed/headachey.

I'm old, I like product.