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For me, most of her cheesiness/cringiness comes from her social media Instagram, but social media invites that anyway with positive reinforcement of any stupid thing one posts + total availability at all times.

As for the tours, she's an old lady now so of course she wants to monologue to hell (everytime I get on a bus I get monologued to death by a random lady who tells me all her life story), so I just dismiss it as being an age-related thing. With Rebel Heart she also wasn't really feeling it and had that Rocco thing going on... I think she was hurting inside.

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Alright, so I'm not sure that cheesy would be the word to use. But I do believe she has relaxed certain qualities of who she used to be. But I also think she is in a different part of her career and life.  The Super Bowl performance was made to appeal to the audience of the Super Bowl. It was also basically the ONLY promotion she did and therefore I would argue ALOT was riding on it. No room for controversy or political statements. There wasn't time for a story ARC of dark to light, so ther

If she had become cheesy she would be very popular. Look at elton John and cher and even gaga, that's what they do basically. The problem with Madonna is that she never does what people expect of her, it does not mean that what she does is good, it's just that she does not behave the way social media imposes to people how to behave. She triggers uneasiness in people. That's the contrary of cheesy.

I don't think Madonna attitude had change much. She's getting older but she has been always a force with hints of narcissism. I think fans read it as cocky, strong woman , don't taking shit from anyone, stubborn. And she still is but now people are judging it because she suppose to turn into some nice grandma. Madonna from the 90s didn't have social media that's why she came out with 'In bed with Madonna' She always wore what she wanted, change her hair, do her own thing. I think right

On 1/13/2021 at 12:02 AM, deathproof said:

Did you attend his concert? I did. It wasn’t old farts. I’m also 2 months shy of being 31. You’d be surprised how many people in their 20’s and 30’s listen to the likes of Elton, Queen, and Fleetwood Mac. Good music is timeless and isn’t associated to certain generations...

I’ve seen Elton in the past. Maybe it’s different in Australia but here in the US most people there were over 40, with many in their fifties.  Didn’t see any teenagers or people in their 20’s. 

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What some people aren’t taking into account is Madonna has a reputation as a rebel, unlike Elton. If she turned into some kind of nostalgia artist doing Greatest Hits shows like him that would go against what she had stood for. 
Her whole thing is I don’t care what people think. The only reason to do a Greatest Hits based tour is to please other people who demand that and to become more popular. 
I would go to a Greatest Hits tour but only if I feel that’s what she truly wants to do, but because she is pressured into doing it by fans and the media demanding it and bullying her into it. 

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I get that her image is being a rebel but I feel like a film about her life and releasing Greatest Hits albums every decade are also very nostalgia-based artist things to do. I'd love a Greatest Hits Tour personally, and it makes sense to do it if the film is well received and people want to get back to concerts. She has a catalogue of hits like no other, makes sense to celebrate it.

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1 hour ago, deathproof said:

I really don’t see how being a “Rebel” and putting out a greatest hits are so against each other. Why are they different?

I didn’t say putting out a Greatest Hits album. I said doing a Greatest Hits tour which revolves around older hits and not performing new music. 

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14 minutes ago, Ayham said:

Madonna won’t tour again. That’s a fact... even if she does that tour will be the end of her as a touring artist. She changed ALOT since RH tour. She lost her energy...

Honestly, I felt that way with the Rebel Heart Tour. There was a stark difference in the Madonna of 2012 and Madonna of 2015. Weird to see such a huge change in energy in just a three year time span. 

I do wonder if her foot injury in 2014 was worse than she let on. Remember how she was walking with a cane for a while, including at the 2014 Grammys? She chalked it up to a foot bone fracture, if I recall, but she had that cane even in the Rebel Heart rehearsal videos. And now she's using it again every now and then. 

Perhaps she hurt herself pretty badly and that's why she has changed her approach to dancing and live shows so much? I've always felt like Rebel Heart and Madame X both came off as extremely unfinished tours in terms of the concept vs. execution. It's almost like they went into each tour with a bunch of ideas that just didn't work because of her stamina, so they stripped back a bunch of the concepts (e.g. Hold Tight, the drums, the S.E.X. video, scrapped choreography, all the Madame X rehearsal songs she ultimately left out, etc.) and were left with a bit of a rushed show. Remember that both tours had "production delays", and she even mentioned during Madame X that the show still was a work-in-progress (though, clearly her injury took precedence and she ultimately decided to stick with what they had). 

It'd be fascinating to know what the initial ideas were for these two tours vs. what ultimately took place.

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OMG, true @eXtremeOccident I just remembered the cane in 2014! Yeah I think she was in pain all this time but got worse last year. Coz of that the damage is permanent 😞 that’s why her working out changed as well. RH was not that bad her energy was very good & the production was 🔥 Highlights, the intro, Burning Up, Holy Water, Like A Virgin... Music / Candy Shop.

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14 minutes ago, Voguerista said:

I agree. She’s a Showgirl through and through. She lives for the stage. @Ayhami truly believe she’ll be back and bigger than ever. She’ll be on a mission  to reclaim stadium tours vs theatres. I pray and hope. 

I personally think her shows work best in arenas. So I think she should stick to that. Her shows are very visual and you can’t really see the whole picture of what is going on in a stadium. 
She has only rarely played stadiums in the US. 

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8 hours ago, Nobody Knows Me said:

I get that her image is being a rebel but I feel like a film about her life and releasing Greatest Hits albums every decade are also very nostalgia-based artist things to do. I'd love a Greatest Hits Tour personally, and it makes sense to do it if the film is well received and people want to get back to concerts. She has a catalogue of hits like no other, makes sense to celebrate it.

It would be a perfect opportunity for a greatest hits tour, and this is sad, but it can be her farewell tour too

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41 minutes ago, Glindathegood said:

I personally think her shows work best in arenas. So I think she should stick to that. Her shows are very visual and you can’t really see the whole picture of what is going on in a stadium. 
She has only rarely played stadiums in the US. 

I agree. I should have said arenas ( sorry, I have a lot going on right now at home) and I like them way more. 

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11 minutes ago, gonna dress u up said:

It would be a perfect opportunity for a greatest hits tour, and this is sad, but it can be her farewell tour too

Why does everyone want her to quit? It’s odd. Yes, she doesn’t perform all her hits in one show, but she has performed most of her biggest hits at some point. So it’s not as if you haven’t had a chance to hear those. 
People seem very concerned with her popularity. It’s as though you need other people’s permission to like her. People are so worried about what other people think instead of liking something for themselves 

Has there ever been anyone else who has been constantly written off as much as Madonna has even by their own fans. 
 

On the other hand, with the way this Covid mess is going no one may ever tour again. I’m starting to despair there will ever be live in person shows again. I guess she will be too old if there are no live shows for 10 or more years 

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The gyms, perfumes, skin care...the products pushed since '08, yes, cheese. But everyone has a Cher/Lori Davis Hair Care moment now.

Gwen Stefani might just be a game show host to people now, but her 2 solo albums are the blueprint for the next few years that followed. "Wind It Up" was several years before Hard Candy. Go watch that video. The blueprint.

Too much happened in pop culture during those years from Hard Candy to MDNA. And the Gaga feud hurt her with the new generation. She should have recorded a duet with her around the time of SNL and kept it cute. As much as Gaga is influenced by here, Gaga did a lot in those 5 years that I wished M had.

It's funny, I remember going to see her at Tower Records when American Life came out and thinking that was going to be how she started to tour from then on. That she was a Mom and wife now and winding things down in a way. Cut to a year later and her spending the next decade with the most insane huge tours. You never know with her. .

Just my opinion. I find this board and topics like this fascinating.

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On 1/15/2021 at 2:14 PM, Pootz333 said:

The gyms, perfumes, skin care...the products pushed since '08, yes, cheese. But everyone has a Cher/Lori Davis Hair Care moment now.

Gwen Stefani might just be a game show host to people now, but her 2 solo albums are the blueprint for the next few years that followed. "Wind It Up" was several years before Hard Candy. Go watch that video. The blueprint.

Too much happened in pop culture during those years from Hard Candy to MDNA. And the Gaga feud hurt her with the new generation. She should have recorded a duet with her around the time of SNL and kept it cute. As much as Gaga is influenced by here, Gaga did a lot in those 5 years that I wished M had.

It's funny, I remember going to see her at Tower Records when American Life came out and thinking that was going to be how she started to tour from then on. That she was a Mom and wife now and winding things down in a way. Cut to a year later and her spending the next decade with the most insane huge tours. You never know with her. .

Just my opinion. I find this board and topics like this fascinating.

This. So. Much.

Was just watching the Gaga Paparazzi performance on the VMAs, and don't get me wrong....she's GOOD...but she was and is and will always be a different artist than Madonna. Better voice than Madonna? Yes. Better fan engagement? Questionable. Better instrument playing ability? Undeniable.

But better albums and concepts? Not at all.

Better choreography and dancing? Oh please.

Better tours? Honey....Madonna INVENTED the tours that Gaga is doing.

At the end of the day, Madonna should have been gracious about the clear adoration Gaga had for her and taken it in stride. She never was like that with Britney, arguably much greater competition to Madonna at the time. In fact, Gaga could have introduced a whole new generation of gays to Madonna, had they not carried out such a feud....after all, it was Gaga who constantly was referencing Madonna with music videos, photoshoots, what not.

The problem was that Lady Gaga threw Madonna off somehow...she got insecure at just the period in her career where things had started to stumble a little bit. And I really wish she'd had the foresight to see, just like every other pop star she had competed against, that her legacy could have continued to stand out if she'd just ignored Gaga and done her own thing. 

Imagine she had decided to collaborate with her right after the SNL skit? Let's be real, Madonna looked HOT at the time. They would have absolute slayed a Fame Monster era single together (imagine THEY had done Telephone...and tied in the Bonnie & Clyde look from the MDNA Tour for Gaga's Kill Bill-inspired video?...and Gang Bang had been a continuation with the MDNA era?....ugh...never mind me....)

By the way, I totally meant "cringey" instead of "cheesy". Dear God, sorry for starting such a debate on verbiage here :dead:

 

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