POPULAR

[MaDöner Kebab 6,894]

1 hour ago, Prayer said:

It's too early to say this, though. "Vulgar" has been out for literally three days. I think "Popular" working that well made us lose perspective a little bit.

While it's true is not taking the world by storm and not as big as "Popular", it's not exactly a disaster either. The streaming numbers so far are quite good, 2,1M in two days on Spotify only.

Again, it all comes down to Sam's label now and the effort or not they're willing to put into this one. Let's be honest: radio and playlist support is usually payed by the labels. Also, again, this would really benefit from having a music video. Without proper support it'll do good but that's it.

It really isn’t. You can see a clear downward trend.

[xavier 4,800]

Mediabase #USA (Airplay)

POP:
#37 (+21) #Popular 842 165 677 1.127
+102 Spins
+57 Bullet
+0.138 Audience

HOT AC:
#47 (+21) #Popular 101 18 83 0.147
+9 Spins
+6 Bullet
+0.016 Audience

RHYTHMIC:
#28 (+46) #Popular 907 77 830 1.709
+146 Spins
+123 Bullet
+0.241 Audience… twitter.com/i/web/status/1…

[Mden 2,252]

billboard charts

"Popular" debuts at No. 43 on this week's #Hot100. Madonna has now earned Hot 100 hits in five separate decades: 80s, 90s, 00s, 10s, and 20s. 

https://twitter.com/billboardcharts/status/1668350410237567010?s=20 

[Frank 42,683]

36 minutes ago, Mden said:

Madonna has now earned Hot 100 hits in five separate decades: 80s, 90s, 00s, 10s, and 20s. 

THE QUEEN MAKING HERSTORY ONCE AGAIN. BRAVO.

[Donna 16,711]

38 minutes ago, Mden said:

billboard charts

"Popular" debuts at No. 43 on this week's #Hot100. Madonna has now earned Hot 100 hits in five separate decades: 80s, 90s, 00s, 10s, and 20s. 

https://twitter.com/billboardcharts/status/1668350410237567010?s=20 

What's weird, she nearly skated by the 10's without a top 100.  Thank goodness for GMAYL and Bitch I'm Madonna.  They may not be some fans cup of tea, especially GMAYL, but without that song, she wouldn't even had a top 10 track that decade. 

[Prayer 14,511]

14 minutes ago, tscott said:

What's weird, she nearly skated by the 10's without a top 100.  Thank goodness for GMAYL and Bitch I'm Madonna.  They may not be some fans cup of tea, especially GMAYL, but without that song, she wouldn't even had a top 10 track that decade. 

"GMAYL" was only Top 10 because of the Clear Channel radio deal in the first week (payola). That was a promising start on Live Nation/Interscope's part regarding promo and pushing but sadly it lasted... that single on it 1st week and that was all. The didn't even bother with "Girl Gone Wild".

"Bitch I'm Madonna" was organic and a big hit on YouTube. But it was the third single already. It should have been the first single. It was THE song.

[Donna 16,711]

21 minutes ago, Prayer said:

"GMAYL" was only Top 10 because of the Clear Channel radio deal in the first week (payola). That was a promising start on Live Nation/Interscope's part regarding promo and pushing but sadly it lasted... that single on it 1st week and that was all. The didn't even bother with "Girl Gone Wild".

"Bitch I'm Madonna" was organic and a big hit on YouTube. But it was the third single already. It should have been the first single. It was THE song.

Yeah, I'm aware of how GMAYL getting top 10 status because I recall the following week after the Superbowl, the song was dropped like a Hot potato.  Still, I'm glad it gave her only top 10.  I agree there had been far superior songs that came after that (Hello "Ghosttowon) that should have made top 10. 

As for "Bitch, I'm Madonna", I agree that was far more organic, but if it didn't have all the features in the video, I don't think the song would have gone in the Hot 100. 

[Prayer 14,511]

12 minutes ago, tscott said:

Yeah, I'm aware of GMAYL getting top 10 status because I recall the following week after the Superbowl, the song was dropped like a Hot potato.  Still, I'm glad it gave her only top 10.  I agree there had been far superior songs that came after that (Hello "Ghosttowon) that should have made top 10. 

As for "Bitch, I'm Madonna", I agree that was far more organic, but if it didn't have all the features in the video, I don't think the song would have gone in the Hot 100. 

I remember hype around "Bitch I'm Madonna" when the first 6 tracks were released in December 2014 and also, while the cameos drew attention to the video, I don't think it was the pure base of its success... it had replay value. And people liked the song. That's why it's, by far, the most streamed and viewed one from the "Rebel Heart" album. And her 3rd most watched video ever on YouTube!

[Donna 16,711]

5 minutes ago, Prayer said:

I remember hype around "Bitch I'm Madonna" when the first 6 tracks were released in December 2014 and also, while the cameos drew attention to the video, I don't think it was the pure base of its success... it had replay value. And people liked the song. That's why it's, by far, the most streamed and viewed one from the "Rebel Heart" album. And her 3rd most watched video ever on YouTube!

Oh I just mean the Youtube views played a huge part in her streaming numbers and it charting.  I feel a lot of that was due to the fact high profiled entertainers like Beyonce, Miley, Katy Perry and others were featured in the video.  I don't believe it would have done as well or got the replay value without it.  I'm sure being a heavily influenced Diplo track helped its success as well.  So yeah, a lot of factors played in that song being as successful as it got.  That's if you call #88 successful.  I believe it was in the top 100 for a week and out the next.  It seemed to happen the week of the video dropped. 

[Prayer 14,511]

1 minute ago, tscott said:

Oh I just mean the Youtube views played a huge part in her streaming numbers and it charting.  I feel a lot of that was due to the fact high profiled entertainers like Beyonce, Miley, Katy Perry and others were featured in the video.  I don't believe it would have done as well or got the replay value without it.  I'm sure being a heavily influenced Diplo track helped its success as well.  So yeah, a lot of factors played in that song being as successful as it got.  That's if you call #88 successful.  I believe it was in the top 100 for a week and out the next.  It seemed to happen the week of the video dropped. 

The cameos helped, no doubt about it. And yes, the Hot 100 entry was the week after the release of the video. But sometimes success can not be measured only by a chart position, especially in the 10s, where rules and formats were transitioning to where we are now, with streaming dominating the charts.

In the end it's about what songs people remember years after and if you ask about Madonna's songs of the 10s probably "Bitch I'm Madonna" is the only one or one of the fews that (some of) the general public could mention. People knew about that single.

[Donna 16,711]

15 minutes ago, Prayer said:

The cameos helped, no doubt about it. And yes, the Hot 100 entry was the week after the release of the video. But sometimes success can not be measured only by a chart position, especially in the 10s, where rules and formats were transitioning to where we are now, with streaming dominating the charts.

In the end it's about what songs people remember years after and if you ask about Madonna's songs of the 10s probably "Bitch I'm Madonna" is the only one or one of the fews that (some of) the general public could mention. People knew about that single.

Oh no doubt, it's a song the GP knew more than anything else she's done in that decade.  It's sad though because while I enjoyed and like BIM, there were so many more great songs from Rebel Heart, deserved to be a hit.  The title track;  Ghosttown, maybe Devil Pray and Joan of Arc.  Though there just wasn't any push from Interscope.  But then, I always felt they were simply a distributor at that point and it was up to Madonna and her management team to push the song.  It seemed the same for MDNA and I'm not sure Interscope had much to do with the radio deal Madonna struck to have GMAYL played so often during the SuperBowl.  I feel that had more to do with a bigger entity CLEAR CHANNEL that partnered with the Superbowl.  Though, I'm not really too sure who was all involved in getting that radio deal with Clear Channel, but it could have all to do with her involvement with Superbowl, they were willing to play the song as they did. If Interscope was involved, they certainly didn't do much after to help keep the song getting more radio airplay following the Superbowl week.

[androiduser 2,491]

Just watched episode two of The Idol.... that song Jocelyn reworked with the guru it's exactly the same as the original with some added huffing and growling   and she's all like "Nobody's doing this!!!" like she came up with I Feel Love in the 70's or something and the team is shocked by her angst and rebellion And then she's all like "Fine!!! i'm just gonna release it MYSELF!" and her team is like

It's soooo entertaining, a total trainwreck

[Prayer 14,511]

11 minutes ago, tscott said:

Oh no doubt, it's a song the GP knew more than anything else she's done in that decade.  It's sad though because while I enjoyed and like BIM, there were so many more great songs from Rebel Heart, deserved to be a hit.  The title track;  Ghosttown, maybe Devil Pray and Joan of Arc.  Though there just wasn't any push from Interscope.  But then, I always felt they were simply a distributor at that point and it was up to Madonna and her management team to push the song.  It seemed the same for MDNA and I'm not sure Interscope had much to do with the radio deal Madonna struck to have GMAYL played so often during the SuperBowl.  I feel that had more to do with a bigger entity CLEAR CHANNEL that partnered with the Superbowl.  Though, I'm not really too sure who was all involved in getting that radio deal with Clear Channel, but it could have all to do with her involvement with Superbowl, they were willing to play the song as they did. If Interscope was involved, they certainly didn't do much after to help keep the song getting more radio airplay following the Superbowl week.

I think Live Nation payed for that deal, maybe it was always part of the agreement or simply to kick things off properly and give a good image to her. In the end she owed them three big tours then yet. In the beginning all relationships are good. 

What I always found amusing is how honest they were about the deal (when it was clearly payola disguised as an agreement), they even sent a press release about it:

https://web.archive.org/web/20150930102332/http://www.iheartmedia.com/pages/Clear-Channel-and-Madonna-Partner-to-Launch-Worldwide-Multi-Platform-Premiere-of-Her-Latest-Single-“Give-Me-All-Your-Luvin’.aspx

In the whole Madonna-Gaga war (sigh) I'm surprised Gaga's fans didn't use this against M. - or maybe they did and I don't remember now.

[Donna 16,711]

14 minutes ago, Prayer said:

I think Live Nation payed for that deal, maybe it was always part of the agreement and simply to kick things off properly and give a good image to her. In the end she owed them three big tours then yet. In the beginning all relationships are good. 

What I always found amusing is how honest they were about the deal (when it was clearly payola disguised as an agreement), they even sent a press release about it:

https://web.archive.org/web/20150930102332/http://www.iheartmedia.com/pages/Clear-Channel-and-Madonna-Partner-to-Launch-Worldwide-Multi-Platform-Premiere-of-Her-Latest-Single-“Give-Me-All-Your-Luvin’.aspx

In the whole Madonna-Gaga war (sigh) I'm surprised Gaga's fans didn't use this against M. - or maybe they did and I don't remember now.

See that is why I thought Interscope simply played the part of the distributor and really had no obligations to promote her.  I always thought that it was Live Nation was going to do the foot work to promote her.  In fact, that all probably stemmed with her 360 deal when Live Nation had plans to become a distributor, but it never materialize, leaving Madonna to scramble for a Record distributor when she was ready to release MDNA. And that's when Univeral/Interscope made a deal to distribute three albums. And to make the best of their deal, that's probably why they nixed the idea to make Rebel Heart a double album as that would complete their deal with her.  I'm sure they were hoping to milk another album from her as planned. 

As for the whole Gaga feud, I always felt that was more one sided with Gaga and of course the fan bases just fueled it more.  I never felt Madonna played any part in that.  Even when Madonna used the word "Reductive", it was in regards to the song and really wasn't a dig at Lady Gaga.  But of course, the fan bases and the media ran with it and turned it into something that wasn't.  Not to say, I don't believe Gaga didn't use it to play a victim.  I also felt she didn't help to fan the fire.  She kept feeding the fire and her fan base ran with it. Being the Madonna fan base can get quite toxic, it spun totally out of control. 

[Prayer 14,511]

17 minutes ago, tscott said:

See that is why I thought Interscope simply played the part of the distributor and really had no obligations to promote her.  I always thought that it was Live Nation was going to do the foot work to promote her.  In fact, that all probably stemmed with her 360 deal when Live Nation had plans to become a distributor, but it never materialize, leaving Madonna to scramble for a Record distributor when she was ready to release MDNA. And that's when Univeral/Interscope made a deal to distribute three albums. And to make the best of their deal, that's probably why they nixed the idea to make Rebel Heart a double album as that would complete their deal with her.  I'm sure they were hoping to milk another album from her as planned. 

As for the whole Gaga feud, I always felt that was more one sided with Gaga and of course the fan bases just fueled it more.  I never felt Madonna played any part in that.  Even when Madonna used the word "Reductive", it was in regards to the song and really wasn't a dig at Lady Gaga.  But of course, the fan bases and the media ran with it and turned it into something that wasn't.  Not to say, I don't believe Gaga didn't use it to play a victim.  I also felt she didn't help to fan the fire.  She kept feeding the fire and her fan base ran with it. Being the Madonna fan base can get quite toxic, it just totally got out of control. 

I don't want to spark the Gaga vs. Madonna thing again cause I always thought it was quite unfortunate for both, but Madonna knew what she was doing and played it to the max. And she lost the next generation in the process. She was smart enough to win the Britney stans in the 00s, but she lost the Gaga stans forever, and that meant a big, big part of her next potential audience at the time. If you were a teenager then and adored Gaga the next natural step would have been liking Madonna too later. But she made herself unlikable to them. The whole "Express Yourself"/"Born This Way"/"She's Not Me" mash up on the "MDNA Tour" was... simply not necessary.

About Interscope and Live Nation, as far as I know, Interscope had already a business relationship with Live Nation and that's what they used them for the deal.

[Phoenix-f- 7]

If it reaches Top 40, Madonna will be the only female artist to do that in 5 decades.

Please keep streaming Popular.

[Prayer 14,511]

5 minutes ago, Phoenix-f- said:

If it reaches Top 40, Madonna will be the only female artist to do that in 5 decades.

Please keep streaming Popular.

If you want to really help and you're in the US: BUY it. 1,29 $ on iTunes.

If you want to really, really, really help, then buy the explicit version and also the clean version. 2 sales.

You need 100 streams to equal a sale. Buy it and then stream it.

[chaosmen1984mk 807]

When several artists come together to make a song, the order in which their names will be placed in the credits is usually decided based on their popularity or significance. That is why the first places will be reserved for the most important and successful artists while the last places will go to those artists of less importance or those who lack global impact. 

An example of this is the song Lady Marmalade where Christina Aguilera, PInk, Lil Kim and Maya participated. The first place in the credits was naturally reserved for Christina Aguilera who was the most important and the most successful of that group because of her beautiful and wonderful records. The second place in the credits went to PInk and the last places to the other two singers whose fame, presence and global impact could not be compared to that of Christina Aguilera. This order in the credits, by the way, was respected in all the charts and in all the music channels worldwide.

 

Having said this, I can't understand what is the justification for putting Madonna in the last place of the credits of this beautiful song. As a fan I find it disrespectful that Madonna is named after Plaiboi CArti as if he were more important or transcendent than her. I don't know if this error was intentional or an inexcusable oversight on the part of The Weeknd, but it makes me angry to see that even on charts, like Billboard for example, they also put Madonna's name in last place, thus detracting from her legacy.

Fortunately there are exceptions such as the case of Dua Lipa or Quavo who had the good sense to put Madonna in second place in the credits of their respective songs. Because the recognition towards a legend like Madonna is shown even in those small details. And it's not just Madonna's fans who appreciate it, because I'm sure that, even if she doesn't express it openly, Madonna herself does too.

[Prayer 14,511]

15 minutes ago, chaosmen1984mk said:

When several artists come together to make a song, the order in which their names will be placed in the credits is usually decided based on their popularity or significance. That is why the first places will be reserved for the most important and successful artists while the last places will go to those artists of less importance or those who lack global impact. 

An example of this is the song Lady Marmalade where Christina Aguilera, PInk, Lil Kim and Maya participated. The first place in the credits was naturally reserved for Christina Aguilera who was the most important and the most successful of that group because of her beautiful and wonderful records. The second place in the credits went to PInk and the last places to the other two singers whose fame, presence and global impact could not be compared to that of Christina Aguilera. This order in the credits, by the way, was respected in all the charts and in all the music channels worldwide.

 

Having said this, I can't understand what is the justification for putting Madonna in the last place of the credits of this beautiful song. As a fan I find it disrespectful that Madonna is named after Plaiboi CArti as if he were more important or transcendent than her. I don't know if this error was intentional or an inexcusable oversight on the part of The Weeknd, but it makes me angry to see that even on charts, like Billboard for example, they also put Madonna's name in last place, thus detracting from her legacy.

Fortunately there are exceptions such as the case of Dua Lipa or Quavo who had the good sense to put Madonna in second place in the credits of their respective songs. Because the recognition towards a legend like Madonna is shown even in those small details. And it's not just Madonna's fans who appreciate it, because I'm sure that, even if she doesn't express it openly, Madonna herself does too.

"Lady Marmalade" was 2001. It's 2023 now. The order is not about importance. It's about who's paying for the song and it's the main artist. "Popular" is a The Weeknd song. He and his label are paying for everything. Of course he's gotta be first. Same for Sam Smith on "Vulgar". Or Dua Lipa on the "Levitating" remix.

The order is not that relevant now, as far as they're all credited, cause they all get the streams and that's what matters. Madonna has gone from 24M to 34M monthly listeners on Spotify in ten days. That's what truly matters in 2023 and not if she's tagged first, second or third on the release.

[Donna 16,711]

1 hour ago, Prayer said:

I don't want to spark the Gaga vs. Madonna thing again cause I always thought it was quite unfortunate for both, but Madonna knew what she was doing and played it to the max. And she lost the next generation in the process. She was smart enough to win the Britney stans in the 00s, but she lost the Gaga stans forever, and that meant a big, big part of her next potential audience at the time. If you were a teenager then and adored Gaga the next natural step would have been liking Madonna too later. But she made herself unlikable to them. The whole "Express Yourself"/"Born This Way"/"She's Not Me" mash up on the "MDNA Tour" was... simply not necessary.

About Interscope and Live Nation, as far as I know, Interscope had already a business relationship with Live Nation and that's what they used them for the deal.

I totally get you regarding the Gaga and Madonna feud.  I just felt Madonna really didn't start or fuel it until she made the "reductive" comment and even then it was more about the song then Gaga herslef. I guess you could say she could have said more to squash the nonsense that was coming from the fan bases. But that animosity started early on and she did appear with Lady Gaga on SNL to mock a feud, but I just felt the fan bases were so desperate for a fight and Lady Gaga was the one who fell for it and responded to it when Madonna really said nothing, until she said Born This Way seemed "reductive" and again it wasn't really a dig at Gaga, but the song, but fans twisted it as if Madonna called her reductive. The Mash up on MDNA seemed like more of a response to Lady Gaga ignoring the obvious similarities many found with Born This Way and Express Yourself. I felt Madona was being tongue and cheek with the whole thing. If she was truly bothered by it, she could have seeked legal action. Personally, I think it was a coincidence the similairties some found with Express Yourself and Born This Way.  I mean no one can deny their was some similarities.  Yet, Lady Gaga went out of her way to deny being influenced by Madonna when so much of what she did in her career up to that point seemed to be heavily influenced by Madonna.

 

[Blue Prince 995]

23 minutes ago, chaosmen1984mk said:

When several artists come together to make a song, the order in which their names will be placed in the credits is usually decided based on their popularity or significance. That is why the first places will be reserved for the most important and successful artists while the last places will go to those artists of less importance or those who lack global impact. 

An example of this is the song Lady Marmalade where Christina Aguilera, PInk, Lil Kim and Maya participated. The first place in the credits was naturally reserved for Christina Aguilera who was the most important and the most successful of that group because of her beautiful and wonderful records. The second place in the credits went to PInk and the last places to the other two singers whose fame, presence and global impact could not be compared to that of Christina Aguilera. This order in the credits, by the way, was respected in all the charts and in all the music channels worldwide.

 

Having said this, I can't understand what is the justification for putting Madonna in the last place of the credits of this beautiful song. As a fan I find it disrespectful that Madonna is named after Plaiboi CArti as if he were more important or transcendent than her. I don't know if this error was intentional or an inexcusable oversight on the part of The Weeknd, but it makes me angry to see that even on charts, like Billboard for example, they also put Madonna's name in last place, thus detracting from her legacy.

Fortunately there are exceptions such as the case of Dua Lipa or Quavo who had the good sense to put Madonna in second place in the credits of their respective songs. Because the recognition towards a legend like Madonna is shown even in those small details. And it's not just Madonna's fans who appreciate it, because I'm sure that, even if she doesn't express it openly, Madonna herself does too.

If this is actually true, was GMAYL that featured MIA before Nicki Minaj, implying that Nicki lacked global impact? She had blown up the year before with the release of Super Bass, had a spectacular feature on the most acclaimed album of the decade and then went on to become the Queen of Rap. MIA had a huge hit of course with Paper Planes and Bad Girls maybe but she wasn't even the star of GMAYL the way miss Minaj was.

EDIT: MIA is only first on the video title. On her website Nicki is mentioned first. Perhaps they changed it after the release of the video and before the album came out.

[Prayer 14,511]

6 minutes ago, tscott said:

I totally get you regarding the Gaga and Madonna feud.  I just felt Madonna really didn't start or fuel it until she made the "reductive" comment and even then it was more about the song then Gaga herslef. I guess you could say she could have said more to squash the nonsense that was coming from the fan bases. But that animosity started early on and she did appear with Lady Gaga on SNL to mock a feud, but I just felt the fan bases were so desperate for a fight and Lady Gaga was the one who fell for it and responded to it when Madonna really said nothing, until she said Born This Way seemed "reductive" and again it wasn't really a dig at Gaga, but the song, but fans twisted it as if Madonna called her reductive. The Mash up on MDNA seemed like more of a response to Lady Gaga ignoring the obvious similarities many found with Born This Way and Express Yourself. I felt Madona was being tongue and cheek with the whole thing. If she was truly bothered by it, she could have seeked legal action. Personally, I think it was a coincidence the similairties some found with Express Yourself and Born This Way.  I mean no one can deny their was some similarities.  Yet, Lady Gaga went out of her way to deny being influenced by Madonna when so much of what she did in her career up to that point seemed to be heavily influenced by Madonna.

 

Madonna tried to play irony in a world where everything was (and is) literal now. That's why it didn't work and she lost that "battle". With still all the challenges of being an older artist, I think she would have had a better 10s commercial decade if she had gained Gaga fans instead of loosing them forever in 2012. But it's been 11 years now, who cares xd

[Donna 16,711]

1 hour ago, Prayer said:

Madonna tried to play irony in a world where everything was (and is) literal now. That's why it didn't work and she lost that "battle". With still all the challenges of being an older artist, I think she would have had a better 10s commercial decade if she had gained Gaga fans instead of loosing them forever in 2012.

I just think she didn't care. She didn't realize how impactful the fan bases were during the feud.  Again, I'm not saying Madonna couldn't have handle it better, but I don't think she really think it was a big deal.  Remember it wasn't until sometime after this feud she even embraced Social Media.  A lot of fans were begging for her to be more involved in social media, but then when she did now they don't want her to be.  It's hilarious in some ways. 

I do think we can agree that Madonna really hasn't lost much during this time.  Sure, she could have made some better choices, but I also feel like whatever she did, she has an industry that is so shallow and ageist that no matter what she did, people would have found ways to discredit her. 

I personally thing, the way she keeps pushing more and more will be more accepting of her.  I think of Betty White. She was hardly beloved during her prime, but as she got older and older, people fell in love with her. They appreciate her abrasive behavior. She didn't care  what people though of her.  I guess Madonna might be a bit more hardcore than Betty White, but I do think a lot of people end up appreciating older people who don't give zero fucks what people think. Madonna is definitely taking on that territory.

[chaosmen1984mk 807]

1 hour ago, Prayer said:

"Lady Marmalade" was 2001. It's 2023 now. The order is not about importance. It's about who's paying for the song and it's the main artist. "Popular" is a The Weeknd song. He and his label are paying for everything. Of course he's gotta be first. Same for Sam Smith on "Vulgar". Or Dua Lipa on the "Levitating" remix.

The order is not that relevant now, as far as they're all credited, cause they all get the streams and that's what matters. Madonna has gone from 24M to 34M monthly listeners on Spotify in ten days. That's what truly matters in 2023 and not if she's tagged first, second or third on the release.

Well, I was only referring to the second place in the credits because naturally the owner of the song has to go first, that's indisputable. That is why I highlighted the examples of Dua Lipa and Quavo who officially placed Madonna in the second place of the credits and the other singers who participated in the last place as it should be.

The order of the factors does not change the product, it is a multiplication rule and it could also be used to analyze the success of a song in which many artists participate. But leaving aside that aspect of reproductions and sales, I still think that seeing Madonna in the last place is to detract from her importance. Perhaps in  songs where up to 3 artists participate this aspect is not so noticeable but imagine a song where 7, 8 or even 10 artists sing and Madonna is named at the end of all of them in the credits. Would you still think the same?

[Glassy24 998]

I don't think anyone would care lmao. Also, it could be the order of appearance.