No hating but...what happened to Madonna after 2007?

[OHDaddy 17]

The most depressing thread I ever read. 

It feels like a nightmare 

[Prayer 14,431]

53 minutes ago, Leona Helmsley said:

or heartbreak city......

Cut me down the middle
Fucked me up a little
You said I was your queen
I tried to give you everything
And now you want your freedom

You got just what you came for
A bit of fame and fortune
I'm no longer needed

You said it was over
Wanted it to end
Then you had the nerve to say
That we could still be friends

You had a few secrets
I was never told
Now everyone's talking
And I'm the last to know

Now I'm in the middle of heartbreak city
'Cause I'm in the middle of a world not pretty
Your clever game got the best of me
But you ain't gonna get the rest of me
'Cause I'm in heartbreak city

You tore me into pieces
You didn't have no damn reason
I let you in my house
You helped yourself to everything
And left me with your mess

I curse the day we met
The memory is haunting me
I wish I could forget

You said it was over
Wanted it to end
Then you had the nerve to say
That we could still be friends

You had a few secrets
I was never told
Now everyone's talking
And I'm the last to know

I'm in the middle of heartbreak city
Now I'm in the middle of a world not pretty

Your clever game got the best of me
But you ain't gonna get the rest of me
'Cause I'm in heartbreak city
And it's not that pretty

 

with this part 

You had a few secrets
I was never told
Now everyone's talking
And I'm the last to know

who say it all .......

we just need her lyrics to understand how she is still angry at him and at that wedding....... and how she feel devastated.........

 

Agree with you in everything but "HeartBreakCity" (like other "revenge" songs on "Rebel Heart" like "Unapologetic Bitch") was for Brahim, not Guy, though, he cheated on her with her own trainer (I mean, what a pair of IDIOTS).

Not that he even deserved a song... but he got it anyway.

[Leona Helmsley 9,418]

13 minutes ago, Prayer said:

Agree with you in everything but "HeartBreakCity" (like other "revenge" songs on "Rebel Heart" like "Unapologetic Bitch") was for Brahim, not Guy, though, he cheated on her with her own trainer (I mean, what a pair of IDIOTS).

Not that he even deserved a song... but he got it anyway.

really? i was sure sure and sure it was for guy!!!! i discover it after years!!!!

oh 

my 

god......

my life will change forever now......... i'm in shock.......

[Blue Skies 1,307]

Bottom line to me she tried real hard to be something she sort of isn't with Guy R.  So some of that behavior afterwards can be attributed to burnout.

 

I think with this tour though she is sort of back in her element and doing what she loves...  working hard and performing.  

[Honey Little 4,050]

Boo hoo hoo. 🦉 

[Leona Helmsley 9,418]

3 minutes ago, Honey Little said:

Boo hoo hoo. 🦉 

[MikeyK 691]

Didn’t she also have a sort of falling out w/the Kabbalah center higher ups some time around 2008? It noticeably became less present in her work after the Confessions Tour.

Anyway, I agree w/the suggestions that the divorce along w/turning 50 and the accompanying life changes may have made her seem to take a different path from where she’d been in the decade or so prior.

I’ve always felt Kabbalah and her involvement in it was as controlling of her output as her marriage to Guy allegedly was.

[chaosmen1984mk 806]

The future is not always synonymous with evolution. I mean, how different the debates were in the forum back in 2020, the year this topic was created. I have to recognize the quality of the vast majority of the comments and how everyone tried to explain their position on the topic in a rational and detailed way. Totally opposite to what is happening now, 2024, with the recent proliferation of trolls  who, instead of contributing, simply lower the level of the debate with their silly and pathetic comments, discouraging much more valuable posters from participating in current debates.

 

 

[Would You Like To Try 8,357]

On 3/30/2024 at 12:40 PM, OHDaddy said:

The most depressing thread I ever read. 

It feels like a nightmare 

Same opinion as you,I have some reasons and that is that there are definetely some that still want her as her 2005 era and she always changes!

[skyfitswim 906]

On 2/11/2020 at 1:35 AM, Tiago Lisboa Rodrigues said:

Let's sit down guys cause this is going to take a while and i'm about to vent a bit:

I was just watching Oprah's 1998 interview and then the Live Earth performance from 2007 for the first time in years...and i was thinking about how she looked like a completely different person back then. Not just physically, but her attitude as well.

I also realized...it was the last time we saw old school Madonna on stage with no major cosmetic surgery and before the drama hit her marriage, before Hard Candy, before S&S tour and before she was considered to be "following trends instead of creating them" as people say. She was just...so cool and confident on that stage! Amazing vocals, dancing 100% of the time, choreo on point. That's who i fell in love with.

A lot is said about how Guy Oseary taking over changed things...and even though i agree, it's also okay to point out how this was the point Madonna as a person changed, right? Am i alone in this?

What do you guys think happened at the end of that marriage that shaped Madonna to being the person she is right now? She literally went from being an english housewife that writes children books and has a british accent to excessive plastic surgery, dating boytoys, an overall less secure person than before to the point she's not even comfortable on letting her ego share a talk show with other people. I mean...her Graham Norton show appearances even from 2012 to 2019 are night and day honestly.

Career wise she always progressed in terms of ideas and you could feel an artistic evolution from her first album until American Life. Re-Invention Tour and the Confessions era was her "damage control" phase and worked for her. Why? She knew she had to deliver. Thinking only about herself and her artistic growth wouldn't get her anywhere and this IS a business after all. She was still modern, but doing 70's inspired disco music and that attracted multiple generations but everyone thought she was the coolest. i remember it so well. It was also the first Madonna era i was a fan of hers. My parents loved her, i was almost 18 and loved her. My cousins weren't even 10 and loved her.

How did we go from this to wearing grillz, dating boy toys, that Drake kiss, Bitch I'm Madonna phase, whatever she did at that VMA award where she told that Aretha Franklin story that went nowhere while dressed like...that. Going completely unprepared to Eurovision. How bad her vocal preparation was for that and even the BB Awards performances, and most of all...how unprofessional she became?

She was going through hell during S&S in 2008 and somehow she always kept it professional. Yes she could start a show like half an hour after its initial time...but nothing major.

How did we go from that stadium tour to  a theater tour that couldn't be worse organized, from that lottery program, to delayed shows at the start of the tour, then each city, then cancellations 3 hours before showtime, to Madonna saying she's being censored by the UK's curfew? Like...she's been performing there since the 80's. She always did her shows because she showed up on time. How can she not realize all this?

I always loved her, and i think i always will...but Madonna since Eurovision has been even harder to be...likable, even as a diehard fan. Never in a million years i ever expected Madonna to perform to an audience of over 200 million people completely unprepared like that. 

Is she really living in such a bubble that she doesn't realize everything bad she's doing to her career?

Has she been told so many times how great she is, she actually started to believe she was? She was always great at this business because she knew her strengths and lows...which right now...she doesn't. Speaking of which...i won't even mention the fact she went on doing a stadium tour in 2012 with basically album tracks (and hits completely changed from their original versions) from an album that didn't sell 2 million copies. Just 4 years before, she did a stadium tour and of course...she did hits. You NEED to know your audience. Somehow...she doesn't anymore. 

And yes she was always bitchy, sometimes cocky, always had a dry and sarcastic sense of humor, that's still there to this day. But she was always a pro. A hard working pro. And we could always count on her to deliver and she was always the best at doing that. 

Now she can still be...after waiting for hours...in venues with no AC on, after we stressed for months over lottery programs, canceled shows, reschedules, etc.

We also started to witness her victimizing herself more and more. Yes ageism exists...but you can't blame everything on sexism, ageism, etc. Look how she handled the SEX era. Watch those interviews from back then. She outsmarted everyone by being witty and confident. Now she cries on instagram. What happened?

What do you guys think about all this? And please, if you're pretending "this is the same madonna as always"...let's not fool ourselves. She's a totally different person and it's okay to admit. I love her and will always. That's why this is a bit hard to witness. Even harder to see her vocals being so amazing right now. Where was all that before Eurovision? Madame X album recordings (it's clear she had no vocal training before doing this record), etc?

Do you think all we need is a better team?

What's next for her? What do you still expect from Madonna?

i m 100 agreed what you say. 

[Blue Jean 15,319]

It’s interesting seeing this thread now. I think it just shows how great this tour has been for her career. It’s been the return of Madonna for the fans.

[Honey Little 4,050]

Does anyone prefer her music that was released from 2007-Now over pre-2007?

 

personally I prefer pre-2007 if I had to choose.

[Pootz333 2,697]

2 hours ago, Blue Jean said:

It’s interesting seeing this thread now. I think it just shows how great this tour has been for her career. It’s been the return of Madonna for the fans.

I've said it many times watching Celebration, that it's the tour I wanted in '09. 

[TOpher 901]

8 hours ago, Honey Little said:

Does anyone prefer her music that was released from 2007-Now over pre-2007?

 

personally I prefer pre-2007 if I had to choose.

I’m a pre 2007 Stan to the die I die. I don’t really give a toss about much of her work post 2007. A few good songs here and there but don’t really care for the rest. In my opinion the quality of her videos, music and photoshoots have been mid to mediocre at best since.

[love hurts 30]

yea it kinda sucks everytime i watch a interview from the pre2010s eras madonna it just makes me kinda sad it seemed like she went through so much character growth through the 80s/90s/2000s just for it to all be thrown out the window it’s like you watch a video of madonna during the ray of light or american life era  talking about some sophisticated shit then see her on tiktok doing this 

https://vt.tiktok.com/ZSFb6JH2e/

it’s just sad seeing her embarrass herself like that  

what’s confusing is unlike celebs like for example britney or amanda bynes where we can try to pin point events or things that occurred which caused them to change i’m not really sure what happened with madonna that caused her to start behaving the way she is now, however i think she finally noticed as her recent tiktoks and posts haven’t been as…..out there

 

side note: i think the hard candy era gets alot of hate just because she was “following trends” it’s a great album with a lot of great songs i’d rather have madonna follow trends and have good songs than be experimental and release something like madame X which in my opinion is her worst album

Edited April 6 by love hurts (see edit history)

[love hurts 30]

On 4/1/2024 at 10:01 PM, TOpher said:

I’m a pre 2007 Stan to the die I die. I don’t really give a toss about much of her work post 2007. A few good songs here and there but don’t really care for the rest. In my opinion the quality of her videos, music and photoshoots have been mid to mediocre at best since.

same here her run from erotica to confessions was perfect

[survivalartist 6,487]

Also consider her entire music industry has gone through incredible changes throughout her career from radio/records to cassettes to MTV to CDs to the internet/Napster and now digital streaming. Having to pivot big changes like that couldn’t possibly have been easy yet to an extent she did it. Sure there are/were stumbles but that’s part of the fun of the ride. Also I listen to all the decades music pretty equally, sure sometimes I’m in a 90s mood or a ballads mood but my dance playlist covers the whole career and the jumps are not that jarring in most cases. I mean this in a nice way but I don’t have that same experience with my MJ, Prince or Whitney playlists for example (the decades jumping).

[androiduser 2,483]

On 4/1/2024 at 11:38 AM, Blue Jean said:

It’s interesting seeing this thread now. I think it just shows how great this tour has been for her career. It’s been the return of Madonna for the fans.

absolutely! I mean, just compare this tour and Madonna now to Madonna just a year ago... a huge difference

[Drownedboy 1,684]

4 hours ago, love hurts said:

yea it kinda sucks everytime i watch a interview from the pre2010s eras madonna it just makes me kinda sad it seemed like she went through so much character growth through the 80s/90s/2000s just for it to all be thrown out the window it’s like you watch a video of madonna during the ray of light or american life era  talking about some sophisticated shit then see her on tiktok doing this 

https://vt.tiktok.com/ZSFb6JH2e/

it’s just sad seeing her embarrass herself like that  

what’s confusing is unlike celebs like for example britney or amanda bynes where we can try to pin point events or things that occurred which caused them to change i’m not really sure what happened with madonna that caused her to start behaving the way she is now, however i think she finally noticed as her recent tiktoks and posts haven’t been as…..out there

 

side note: i think the hard candy era gets alot of hate just because she was “following trends” it’s a great album with a lot of great songs i’d rather have madonna follow trends and have good songs than be experimental and release something like madame X which in my opinion is her worst album

Yes totally agree. But I think the lowest point was between 2018 till 2022 actually. She became really strange, looked very bad sometimes and did many strange things as the milk bath video during the covid times. Madame x for me is her worst, but worse was the music she released after that. Then the injuries. the cancelation of tour dates...I think she was really really depressed or bad psicologhically, even destroying her body shape.

 

But, on a positive note, and even she really can´t dance as before, but who care as she is 65 and looking again fabulous, this last tour is a very positive step again, a huge success, and I bet she is going to do good things again, in the vein of her amazing and fabulous and umatchable legacy as the history biggest pop artist ever.

 

[TOpher 901]

20 hours ago, love hurts said:

yea it kinda sucks everytime i watch a interview from the pre2010s eras madonna it just makes me kinda sad it seemed like she went through so much character growth through the 80s/90s/2000s just for it to all be thrown out the window it’s like you watch a video of madonna during the ray of light or american life era  talking about some sophisticated shit then see her on tiktok doing this 

https://vt.tiktok.com/ZSFb6JH2e/

it’s just sad seeing her embarrass herself like that  

what’s confusing is unlike celebs like for example britney or amanda bynes where we can try to pin point events or things that occurred which caused them to change i’m not really sure what happened with madonna that caused her to start behaving the way she is now, however i think she finally noticed as her recent tiktoks and posts haven’t been as…..out there

 

side note: i think the hard candy era gets alot of hate just because she was “following trends” it’s a great album with a lot of great songs i’d rather have madonna follow trends and have good songs than be experimental and release something like madame X which in my opinion is her worst album

Agree. Watching past pre 2010’s interviews just seems like a completely different person. I miss that artist so much. 

[Redha DBL 7,383]

I can't believe i've read what i've read in the last few comments of this thread and no crazy stan came up to say how sad you are and that you don't have a life you enjoy to be so nasty to Madonna and that you don't have anything to do on a fan forum if you criticize her... This is the kind of discussion i've always wanted to have on a Madonna board but never could without causing a huge drama because of the reason i've mentionned above. That is so pleasing to finally being able to have adults discussion while sharing our opinions, even not positives ones. To me this is so much more interesting than reading 22 pages of weither I'm Breathless is a studio album or not...

[Debord 426]

It's easy to be dismissive of ageing as a reason for anything but what I never see discussed in these (now endless) takes on Madonna is that obviously an artist ages, but we age too, and the interaction we have with them is impacted by both in heaps of ways. I mean, I personally think that a lot of the gay men in particular who do that whole 'I've been a Madonna fan my whole life but...' thing constantly these days have quite glaring issues with their own ageing and seeing that reflected in Madonna.

What would a Madonna who people think is 'still like the Madonna of 25 years ago' be like? What would she be doing? As others have observed, the total music industry and media landscape has transformed around her. She's not our friend, she's not a family member, she's an artist who clearly still wants to keep pushing ahead and to be well into her 5th decade of being successful and still be being spoken about is a pretty incredible achievement. I always think that her legacy is so vast and her impact so huge that if folk who've been fans don't feel they like her anymore, they should just check out and revel in the work they do love, cos really it's spectacularly easy to not see her Instagram/TikTok posts if they bother you.

[Redha DBL 7,383]

15 hours ago, Debord said:

It's easy to be dismissive of ageing as a reason for anything but what I never see discussed in these (now endless) takes on Madonna is that obviously an artist ages, but we age too, and the interaction we have with them is impacted by both in heaps of ways. I mean, I personally think that a lot of the gay men in particular who do that whole 'I've been a Madonna fan my whole life but...' thing constantly these days have quite glaring issues with their own ageing and seeing that reflected in Madonna.

What would a Madonna who people think is 'still like the Madonna of 25 years ago' be like? What would she be doing? As others have observed, the total music industry and media landscape has transformed around her. She's not our friend, she's not a family member, she's an artist who clearly still wants to keep pushing ahead and to be well into her 5th decade of being successful and still be being spoken about is a pretty incredible achievement. I always think that her legacy is so vast and her impact so huge that if folk who've been fans don't feel they like her anymore, they should just check out and revel in the work they do love, cos really it's spectacularly easy to not see her Instagram/TikTok posts if they bother you.

Age has nothing to do with it at all. If she had been singing silly lyrics like "Let's take our tops off cause bitches i'm Madonna" with huge fake lips and fake ass while drinking non-stop rosé with absolutely no essence behind all that in 1998 many fans and non-fans would have made the exact same analysis. You just cannot read all the elaborated concerns of long time fans and simply blame it on her age. It's easy, over-used and reductive in my opinion. The age card has been used too many times before and people don't buy it anymore. 

[Debord 426]

27 minutes ago, Redha DBL said:

Age has nothing to do with it at all. If she had been singing silly lyrics like "Let's take our tops off cause bitches i'm Madonna" with huge fake lips and fake ass while drinking non-stop rosé with absolutely no essence behind all that in 1998 many fans and non-fans would have made the exact same analysis. You just cannot read all the elaborated concerns of long time fans and simply blame it on her age. It's easy, over-used and reductive in my opinion. The age card has been used too many times before and people don't buy it anymore. 

Madonna sang plenty of "silly lyrics" in the 90s and the idea the past 15 years has been characterised by "silly lyrics" is just utterly nonsense. And saying age has nothing to do with it then immediately going to a ridiculous representation of her appearance says it all.

[xavier 4,788]

Meanwhile Madonna this week in 2024